From: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com (canslim-digest) To: canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: canslim-digest V2 #2699 Reply-To: canslim Sender: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-No-Archive: yes canslim-digest Wednesday, July 31 2002 Volume 02 : Number 2699 In this issue: Re: [CANSLIM] LNOP (was Tomorrow -off topic) Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership Fw: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 16:04:52 -0700 From: "zillagirl" Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] LNOP (was Tomorrow -off topic) This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C238AC.01249420 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you Katherine-that's why I went off topic. He requested opinions = earlier and it interested me so I gave one. Is this o.k., to go off = topic or is it necessary to word it in a canslim type format as you = did? Also could I request your opinion on something. I sent a post this = morning about a W chart-I believe you sent the chart through. The = charts and volume thing is driving me nuts because I'm not seeing it. I = saw a run up and a shake out - a run up and a shake out. Do you have = any advice or thoughts as to why and what to do-or do you see the same = thing at all? I don't understand the mass investor thing that makes a W = or triple bottom happen like I do the cup with a handle. I was hoping to = get a response but didn't, because I'm frustrated by it. But if no = thoughts on how to help, appreciate your time. Thanks Nancy ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Katherine Malm=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 3:42 PM Subject: [CANSLIM] LNOP (was Tomorrow -off topic) Donald & Nancy, Here are the only facts you need to see this is a stinky stock... Cashflow NEGATIVE Earnings NEGATIVE (never had a positive year) Growth in Sales NEGATIVE RS 42 and DECLINING Price LESS THAN 50 and 200 day moving averages Research is one thing if you want to be "in the know" on a technology = with "potential"....but the only way to make (and keep) real money over = the long run is to stick to a discipline and this stock meets absolutely = zero CANSLIM criteria. If this were a short term trading forum, then = we'd be having an different discussion about an entirely different = discipline. Katherine ----- Original Message -----=20 From: zillagirl=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 5:04 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Tomorrow -off topic Donald-I did a little checking on LNOP when I read your post. I am = always interested in new products and in some cases will buy in and wait = for the business to develop and the fundamentals to improve, to buy low. = Apparently EZ Chip won the award for the most highly integrated 10 = Gigabit network processor. This company is a subsidiary of Lan = Optics(semi conductor company). Lan optics holding in EZ Chip was just = increased from 57% to 66 % by issuing Apax-a venture capitalist co. who = held the shares- 1.2 million newly issued shares of Lan Optics, for = their additional stake. The EZ Chip is suppose to save time and money of = up to 80%. I have three things that kept me from going further and = checking acc.-roe-rs etc. 1).Possible dilution of Lan Optic share by 1.2 = million. 2) They are not anticipating sales to affect revenues for = apx. 1 year. 3) Semis not shining lately .I appreciate your bringing it = to my attention and I will follow it , but I think with the market like = it is there may be a better buy in opportunity closer to when company = starts to grow from the new product. But I could be just as wrong as = right. I got my research from T.D. Waterhouse web site. Good Luck with = it. nancy ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Donald Wallker=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Tomorrow=20 I'm so glad to hear from someone in the thick of things that tells = me that emotions, rather than hide-bound calculations ,rule the day = in the market. In truth, I'd rather take a risk, based on the sentiment = of the marketplace together with some reasonable input, than to always = hang my hat on CANSLIM. For example, early this morning I came within = a hair of buying into AYE, not because I thought it was a great = investment but because, at the opening bell it was paying close to %10 = in dividends and I knew in my heart that that would not last. Rather, = I thought I could easily take a %10 to %15 profit by buying early and = selling late today, since, no doubt, the brokers would be pushing the = stock. As it turned out, the ere was more that %10 invloved However, = I found a potentially more favorable, but admittedly longer term = investment, that is, LNOP. for less that its closing price. I'd rather = run a risk for a %500 gain than c\to ontinuously rake in %10 plus gains. = It's all a matter of perspective ------ Donald=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Fred Richards=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 4:46 PM Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] Tomorrow=20 Heck, it was just the wise guys pushing the market up at the = end. Check the volume. Today was month end and they were trying to = pretty up things. The turnaround looks very suspicious from my = perspective particularly as almost all of the recent ones have occurred = after 3 p.m. in NY including this one. For me, I'll look at what the overseas markets are doing and the = pre-market NASDAQ indicator before getting too excited. Further more, = they were substantially more new lows than new highs for both the NYSE = and the NASDAQ.=20 But emotions, not facts, rule markets even among the big = players. -----Original Message----- From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com = [mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Donald Wallker Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 3:06 PM To: canslim@lists.xmission.com Subject: [CANSLIM] Tomorrow=20 "Tomorrow, tomorrow, there's always tomorrow, it's only a day = away." And I suspect that it will be a be a Bull day tomorrow given = the turn-around in todays trading. At this writing we are not yet = closed, but we are far, far up from today's earlier market weakness, = which normally bodes well for tomorrow. So-- to everyone in the Group i = bid you a Happy Tomorrow! - - Donald=20 - ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C238AC.01249420 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you Katherine-that's why I went = off topic. He=20 requested opinions earlier and it interested me so I gave one. Is this = o.k., to=20 go off topic or  is it necessary to word it in a canslim type = format as you=20 did?  Also could I request your opinion on something. I sent a post = this=20 morning about a W chart-I believe you sent the chart through.  The = charts=20 and volume thing is driving me nuts because I'm not seeing it.  I = saw a run=20 up and a shake out - a run up and a shake out.  Do you have any = advice or=20 thoughts as to why and what to do-or do you see the same thing at = all? I=20 don't understand the mass investor thing that makes a W or triple = bottom=20 happen like I do the cup with a handle. I was hoping to get a = response but=20 didn't, because I'm frustrated by it. But if no thoughts on how to help, = appreciate your time.  Thanks Nancy
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Katherine=20 Malm
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 = 3:42=20 PM
Subject: [CANSLIM] LNOP (was = Tomorrow=20 -off topic)

Donald & Nancy,
 
Here are the only facts you need to see this is a stinky = stock...
 
Cashflow NEGATIVE
Earnings NEGATIVE (never had a positive year)
Growth in Sales NEGATIVE
RS 42 and DECLINING
Price LESS THAN 50 and 200 day moving averages
 
Research is one thing if you want to be "in the know" on a = technology=20 with "potential"....but the only way to make (and keep) real money = over the=20 long run is to stick to a discipline and this stock meets = absolutely zero=20 CANSLIM criteria. If this were a short term trading forum, then we'd = be having=20 an different discussion about an entirely different discipline.
 
Katherine
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 zillagirl
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, = 2002 5:04=20 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] = Tomorrow -off=20 topic

Donald-I did a little checking on = LNOP when I=20 read your post. I am always interested in new products and in some = cases=20 will buy in and wait for the business to develop and the = fundamentals to=20 improve, to buy low. Apparently EZ Chip won the award for the = most=20 highly integrated 10 Gigabit network processor.  This company = is a=20 subsidiary of Lan Optics(semi conductor company). Lan optics holding = in EZ=20 Chip was just increased from 57% to 66 % by issuing Apax-a venture=20 capitalist co. who held the shares- 1.2 million newly issued shares = of Lan=20 Optics, for their additional stake. The EZ Chip is suppose to save = time and=20 money of up to 80%.  I have three things that kept me from = going=20 further and checking acc.-roe-rs etc. 1).Possible dilution of Lan = Optic=20 share by 1.2 million.      2) They are not=20 anticipating sales to affect revenues for apx. 1 year. 3)  = Semis not=20 shining lately .I appreciate your bringing it to my attention and I = will=20 follow it , but I think with the market like it is there may be a = better buy=20 in opportunity closer to when company starts to grow from the new=20 product. But I could be just as wrong as right. I got my = research from=20 T.D. Waterhouse web site.  Good Luck with it.  = nancy
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Donald = Wallker=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com= =20
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, = 2002 2:21=20 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] = Tomorrow=20

I'm so glad to hear from someone = in the thick=20 of things that tells me that emotions, rather  than=20  hide-bound  calculations ,rule the day in the = market.  In=20 truth, I'd rather take a risk, based on the sentiment of the = marketplace=20 together with some reasonable input, than to always hang my hat on = CANSLIM.   For example, early this morning  I came = within a=20 hair of buying into AYE, not because I thought it was a great = investment=20 but because, at the opening bell it was paying close to = %10  in=20 dividends and  I knew in my heart that that would not = last. =20 Rather, I thought I could easily take a %10 to %15 profit  by = buying=20 early and selling late today, since, no doubt, the brokers would = be=20 pushing the stock.  As it turned out, the ere was more that = %10 =20 invloved  However,  I found a potentially = more favorable,=20  but admittedly longer term investment, that is, LNOP. for = less that=20 its closing price. I'd rather run a risk for a %500 gain than c\to = ontinuously rake in %10 plus gains.  It's all a matter of=20 perspective ------ Donald
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Fred = Richards=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com= =20
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, = 2002 4:46=20 PM
Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] = Tomorrow=20

Heck, it was just the wise guys pushing the market up = at the end.=20 Check the volume. Today was month end and they were trying to = pretty up=20 things. The turnaround looks very suspicious from my = perspective=20 particularly as almost all of the recent ones have occurred = after 3 p.m.=20 in NY including this one.
 
For me, I'll look at what the overseas markets are = doing and the=20 pre-market NASDAQ indicator before getting too excited. Further = more,=20 they were substantially more new lows than new highs for both = the NYSE=20 and the NASDAQ.
 
But emotions, not facts, rule markets even among the = big=20 players.
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 [mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of = Donald=20 Wallker
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 3:06 = PM
To:=20 canslim@lists.xmission.com
Subject: [CANSLIM] = Tomorrow=20

"Tomorrow, tomorrow, there's = always=20 tomorrow, it's only a day away."  And  I suspect = that it=20 will be a be a Bull day tomorrow given the turn-around in = todays=20 trading.  At this writing we are not yet closed, but we = are far,=20 far up from today's   earlier market weakness, which = normally bodes well for tomorrow.  So-- to everyone in=20 the Group i bid you a  Happy Tomorrow! - -=20 = Donald 
- ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C238AC.01249420-- - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 19:36:58 EDT From: Chazmoore@aol.com Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership - --part1_d3.f5e3ba2.2a79ce9a_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gene: I could be wrong about this but I think there are many different types of institutions other than banks and mutual funds. For example, how about pension funds and insurance companies, to name a few. I think WON and DGO places an emphasis on mutual funds because of their research capabilities. Like I said I could be wrong but that would explain the big differences between mutual fund/bank ownership and the total institutional ownership. Charley - --part1_d3.f5e3ba2.2a79ce9a_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gene: I could be wrong about this but I think there are many different types of institutions other than banks and mutual funds. For example, how about pension funds and insurance companies, to name a few. I think WON and DGO places an emphasis on mutual funds because of their research capabilities. Like I said I could be wrong but that would explain the big differences between mutual fund/bank ownership and the total institutional ownership.
Charley - --part1_d3.f5e3ba2.2a79ce9a_boundary-- - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 20:01:34 -0400 From: "Ann" Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01C238CD.125051A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I've been taking notes on all my stocked up Investors Corners, HTMMIS = notes, etc., and WON and his cohorts talk about institutions as: mutual funds banks corporate pension funds insurance companies large investment counselors hedge funds bank trust depts. state, charitable, and education institutions university endowments Ann ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Chazmoore@aol.com=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 7:36 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership Gene: I could be wrong about this but I think there are many different = types of institutions other than banks and mutual funds. For example, = how about pension funds and insurance companies, to name a few. I think = WON and DGO places an emphasis on mutual funds because of their research = capabilities. Like I said I could be wrong but that would explain the = big differences between mutual fund/bank ownership and the total = institutional ownership.=20 Charley=20 - ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01C238CD.125051A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I've been taking notes on all my stocked up = Investors Corners,=20 HTMMIS notes, etc., and WON and his cohorts talk about institutions=20 as:
 
mutual funds
banks
corporate pension funds
insurance companies
large investment counselors
hedge funds
bank trust depts.
state, charitable, and education = institutions
university endowments
 
Ann
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Chazmoore@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 = 7:36=20 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] = Institutional=20 Ownership

Gene: I = could be wrong=20 about this but I think there are many different types of institutions = other=20 than banks and mutual funds. For example, how about pension funds and=20 insurance companies, to name a few. I think WON and DGO places an = emphasis on=20 mutual funds because of their research capabilities. Like I said I = could be=20 wrong but that would explain the big differences between mutual = fund/bank=20 ownership and the total institutional ownership.
Charley=20
- ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01C238CD.125051A0-- - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 20:03:17 -0400 From: "Ann" Subject: Fw: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_004B_01C238CD.4F670D40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I forgot to mention that they state that *not* included in the list are: newsletters analysts brokerage research reports investment advisory services (don't know the difference between that and "large investment = counselors", who are included) - ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ann=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 8:01 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership I've been taking notes on all my stocked up Investors Corners, HTMMIS = notes, etc., and WON and his cohorts talk about institutions as: mutual funds banks corporate pension funds insurance companies large investment counselors hedge funds bank trust depts. state, charitable, and education institutions university endowments Ann ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Chazmoore@aol.com=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 7:36 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership Gene: I could be wrong about this but I think there are many different = types of institutions other than banks and mutual funds. For example, = how about pension funds and insurance companies, to name a few. I think = WON and DGO places an emphasis on mutual funds because of their research = capabilities. Like I said I could be wrong but that would explain the = big differences between mutual fund/bank ownership and the total = institutional ownership.=20 Charley=20 - ------=_NextPart_000_004B_01C238CD.4F670D40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I forgot to mention that they state that *not* = included in the=20 list are:
 
newsletters
analysts
brokerage research reports
investment advisory services
(don't know the difference between that and "large = investment=20 counselors", who are included)
 
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Ann =
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership

I've been taking notes on all my stocked up = Investors Corners,=20 HTMMIS notes, etc., and WON and his cohorts talk about institutions=20 as:
 
mutual funds
banks
corporate pension funds
insurance companies
large investment counselors
hedge funds
bank trust depts.
state, charitable, and education = institutions
university endowments
 
Ann
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Chazmoore@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 = 7:36=20 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] = Institutional=20 Ownership

Gene: I = could be wrong=20 about this but I think there are many different types of institutions = other=20 than banks and mutual funds. For example, how about pension funds and=20 insurance companies, to name a few. I think WON and DGO places an = emphasis on=20 mutual funds because of their research capabilities. Like I said I = could be=20 wrong but that would explain the big differences between mutual = fund/bank=20 ownership and the total institutional ownership.
Charley=20 - ------=_NextPart_000_004B_01C238CD.4F670D40-- - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 19:30:55 -0500 From: Gene Ricci Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01C238C8.CA2F0910 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_01B5_01C238C8.CA2F0910" - ------=_NextPart_001_01B5_01C238C8.CA2F0910 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ann, if DGO is not counting all of the categories from your list.... = their % ownership is way understated !!!! Here is the ownership data block from DGO... =20 =20 Shares Held by Management Represents the percent of total outstanding stock (capitalization) owned = by company officials.=20 Item appears as "Mgmt" on the Datablock =20 Shares Held by Banks Represents the percentage of stock owned by institutional banks. This = amount is based on the floating supply of stock (total shares = outstanding less insider positions and percent held by management). This = information is reported quarterly by approximately 250 banks=20 =20 Shares Held by Mutual Funds Represents the percentage of stock owned by mutual funds. This amount is = based on the floating supply of stock (total shares outstanding less = insider positions and percent held by management).=20 Item appears as "Funds" on the Datablock of a Daily Graphs chart. regards, Gene ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ann=20 To: CANSLIM Listserv=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 7:03 PM Subject: Fw: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership I forgot to mention that they state that *not* included in the list = are: newsletters analysts brokerage research reports investment advisory services (don't know the difference between that and "large investment = counselors", who are included) ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ann=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 8:01 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership I've been taking notes on all my stocked up Investors Corners, HTMMIS = notes, etc., and WON and his cohorts talk about institutions as: mutual funds banks corporate pension funds insurance companies large investment counselors hedge funds bank trust depts. state, charitable, and education institutions university endowments Ann ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Chazmoore@aol.com=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 7:36 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership Gene: I could be wrong about this but I think there are many = different types of institutions other than banks and mutual funds. For = example, how about pension funds and insurance companies, to name a few. = I think WON and DGO places an emphasis on mutual funds because of their = research capabilities. Like I said I could be wrong but that would = explain the big differences between mutual fund/bank ownership and the = total institutional ownership.=20 Charley - ------=_NextPart_001_01B5_01C238C8.CA2F0910 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ann, if DGO is not counting all of the = categories from your list.... their % ownership is way understated=20 !!!!
 
Here is the ownership data block from=20 DGO... 
 
 
 

Shares Held by Management

Represents the percent of total outstanding stock (capitalization) = owned by=20 company officials.=20

Item appears as "Mgmt" on the Datablock

Shares Held by Banks

Represents the percentage of stock owned by institutional banks. This = amount=20 is based on the floating supply of stock (total shares outstanding less = insider=20 positions and percent held by management). This information is reported=20 quarterly by approximately 250 banks

 

Shares Held by Mutual Funds

Represents the percentage of stock owned by mutual funds. This amount = is=20 based on the floating supply of stock (total shares outstanding less = insider=20 positions and percent held by management).=20

Item appears as "Funds" on the Datablock of a Daily Graphs chart.

 

regards,

Gene

 

 

 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ann
To: CANSLIM Listserv
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 = 7:03=20 PM
Subject: Fw: [CANSLIM] = Institutional=20 Ownership

I forgot to mention that they state that *not* = included in=20 the list are:
 
newsletters
analysts
brokerage research reports
investment advisory services
(don't know the difference between that and "large = investment counselors", who are included)
 
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Ann =
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Institutional Ownership

I've been taking notes on all my stocked up = Investors=20 Corners, HTMMIS notes, etc., and WON and his cohorts talk about = institutions=20 as:
 
mutual funds
banks
corporate pension funds
insurance companies
large investment counselors
hedge funds
bank trust depts.
state, charitable, and education = institutions
university endowments
 
Ann
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Chazmoore@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, = 2002 7:36=20 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] = Institutional=20 Ownership

Gene: I = could be=20 wrong about this but I think there are many different types of = institutions=20 other than banks and mutual funds. For example, how about pension = funds and=20 insurance companies, to name a few. I think WON and DGO places an = emphasis=20 on mutual funds because of their research capabilities. Like I said = I could=20 be wrong but that would explain the big differences between mutual = fund/bank=20 ownership and the total institutional ownership.
Charley=20
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