From: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com (klr650-digest) To: klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: klr650-digest V2 #156 Reply-To: klr650 Sender: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk klr650-digest Saturday, March 20 1999 Volume 02 : Number 156 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 23:42:53 -0800 From: "Arne Larsen" Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR Break In (NKLR) - -----Original Message----- From: Skip Faulkner To: KLR650 Page Date: Friday, March 19, 1999 6:21 PM Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR Break In (NKLR) >In case you`re curious, the engines are shipped from >the factory with only storage oil in them. The oil is put in after the bike >is assembled, and then the initial run-in is done. Being in the break-in phase myself, I called the dealer that originally sold my bike (to the guy that owned it for all of 27 kilometers). They told me that the bike came shipped to them with an oil in it that resembled tuna fish oil. The first thing they do at the shop is drain the oil and put in fresh 10 - 40 wt. The reason I initially called them was because the oil level was at the bottom mark of the sight window. Wanting to top it up, I wanted to find out what they put in there. Arne - who spent the day riding in 18 degree C. (55F) weather... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 23:51:13 -0800 From: "Arne Larsen" Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR Break In (NKLR) - -----Original Message----- From: Skip Faulkner To: KLR650 Page Date: Friday, March 19, 1999 9:12 PM Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR Break In (NKLR) > This List is why it`s a shame my wife bought an F650. This List is very much responsible for why I did buy a KLR! Arne - To steal ideas from one person is plagiarism; to steal from many is research ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 00:43:45 -0700 From: "Skip Faulkner" Subject: Re: (klr650) bearings (NKLR) ><< Keep in mind that the 15W`s and 20W`s (in mineral oils) have been said to >be > horsepower robbers in motorcycles. >> >This applies to plain bearing engines, the KLR 650 has at least 8 roller >bearings and fairly low pressure so a thicker oil may not rob any horsepower. >Frank > Frank, I`ve no documentation, but I was told by my Timken rep ( they make bearings for all applications,including engines) that while plain bearings are more affected by heavy oil, rollers encounter enough resistance in heavier weight oil as to raise load levels in most applications they`re used in. But as to is it enough to not use heavier grades, I don`t know. Skip ( feeling a little sluggish myself) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 00:48:15 -0700 From: "Skip Faulkner" Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR Break In (NKLR) > > >>In case you`re curious, the engines are shipped from >>the factory with only storage oil in them. The oil is put in after the bike >>is assembled, and then the initial run-in is done. > >Being in the break-in phase myself, I called the dealer that originally sold >my bike (to the guy that owned it for all of 27 kilometers). They told me >that the bike came shipped to them with an oil in it that resembled tuna >fish oil. The first thing they do at the shop is drain the oil and put in >fresh 10 - 40 wt. >Arne - who spent the day riding in 18 degree C. (55F) weather... > > Arne, You`re right. The oil that was in the bike when your dealer got it was the run-in oil that`s put in when the bike is assemble and first run. Skip ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 01:24:11 -0700 From: "Skip Faulkner" Subject: Re: (klr650) NKLR Sacralege Pure evil sacrilege is what it is! I started this evening reading posts from most recent up, and just came across my wife`s post. My holy-of-holies has been defiled! The nerve of that woman. Survey my foot. I`ll show her a survey. How about " Will an F650 run on sugar-gas?" Now that my sarcasm at her (and her bike`s) expense has been discovered, I`ll have to be more careful when it`s applied, say buried in the middle of a too long oil post. No Stuart, she wasn`t referring to you guys ( both genders) as sheep. She was referring to what SHE would be if she got a KLR just because I had one. To respond to e-mails thinking I`m too hard on my wife, let me assure you, she can take care of herself. Besides that, she also happens to be my best friend and we have fun at each others expense with full understanding that it`s all in jest. When I first met her in college, she had her own motorcycle ( Suzuki 120 dual range trail bike) and it was her only transportation. I was hooked. A 19 year old girl with her own motorcycle, and she knew how to ride it. We`ve put in a lot of miles together over the years and she`s more than competent to pick herself a motorcycle. She really does like the KLR650, she just wants to try out the F650. So don`t worry, no divorce and we`re still madly in love, she`s just made the biggest mistake of her life is all. Gino, send those Kawasaki decals. And by the way, I`m not colorblind. I have better taste in colors than most, just ask Redondo Ron or Kurt. And yes, the KLR was comfy last night. Skip ( it`s hard to sleep with a footpeg in your hip) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 01:31:01 -0700 From: "Skip Faulkner" Subject: Re: (klr650) NKLR Mission Failed (his, not mine) > >Hell, I feel like I'm always taking the lead...someone else step up...I can't believe we >couldn't help Skip find a KLR...I'm just worried she'll convert Dr. Moreau....it's terrible to >think what might happen... > >Kurt A12 Don`t worry, I`m firm in my beliefs and have the strength of my faith. I`m firmly entrenched and she`ll be the first to convert. Skip (getting ready for the exorcism) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 01:33:18 -0700 From: "Skip Faulkner" Subject: Re: (klr650) Oil Chart >The text in the article from which the chart originates indicates the data >is from 1991! > >Yours, > >Guy Right. The API SJ standards weren`t adopted till 1996. Skip ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 05:11:32 EST From: WingRJ@aol.com Subject: (klr650) KLR Parts Good Day There was someone requesting a parts for their KLR. While reading and replying to your Email, my connection crashed. The caused you message to be lost. AOL sees is as read, then deletes it. Please repost a message, I have some of those parts you're asking for. My prices are 50% of what the salvages yards want, that would make it 30% the cost of the original item. See ya ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 02:38:00 -0800 From: "Jeff & Lisa Walker" Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR Break In (NKLR) >Jeff, > What weight oil are you currently using? Is it mineral or synthetic? >Synthetics cause high oil consumption in some bikes. > If you`re using a light weight oil ( any of the 5W`s and 10W`s) switching >to a 20W base or a single grade has had good results in reducing oil >consumption in motorcycle engines. I has a riding buddy with a XT600 that >was burning a quart a tank and switched to Mobil Delvac 1300 Super 15W40, >and cut his oil consumption in half. Delvac is recommended by Mobil as an >alternative for motorcycles. It was designed for diesels and severe use >gasoline engines. It has some thickening agents that help seal at the rings. >Keep in mind that the 15W`s and 20W`s (in mineral oils) have been said to be >horsepower robbers in motorcycles. > I would try different oil weights before trying any additives. Beyond >that, I don`t know of any additives that have actually successfully, been >proven to reduce oil consumption without causing other problems ( like >galley starvation). > OK, so I've been running the Castrol Syntec blend, 20w-50. I tried the full Syntec, but I noticed clutch slippage under full throttle applications in the high rpm's. The Syntec blend seemed to give me the easy shifting without the clutch slippage. But I've noticed the clutch slip with the blend sometimes too. I don't ride that hard very often, as mostly every day my bike is my transportation and I want to get as many miles out of it as I can before having to work on it. I was thinking about fixing the clutch (trying new springs first to see if that worked) and going with a full synthetic again, but now that you said that about increased consumption of synthetics, I'm thinking twice. I might have exaggerated the rate of consumption. Its hard to gauge, because I check it every other morning or so, and if its below the top of the glass I add oil. I'm loath to let the oil level get lower so I can gauge the rate of consumption. I haven't noticed any visible smoke or anything, but I have noticed my white fender turned black from soot from the muffler. I'm really hoping that the bike will go through the summer and fall, so I can work on it in the winter. Anyone else had this problem? I'm thinking that the proper fix is a cylinder hone, new rings, new valve guides and re-lapping the valves in the seats? Am I missing something here? If it were a VW engine, I'd port and polish the intakes and flycut the head too, just to get a bit more oomph out. I'm going to have to spend some time going over the manual (for what that's worth) and see the particulars about the tolerances. Jeff---who should be packing for his trip tomorrow. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 06:21:49 -0500 From: "Steamroller" Subject: Re: (klr650) NKLR - Good dealers, bad dealers We have pretty good dealers around where I live. Dutchess Recreational vehicles is a "superplex dealership". Great prices on new bikes. But I don't used them for parts as they are an hour-plus ride away. Cycle motion is a Kawasaki/Triumph dealer. Really nice guys, but you really have to push hard to get a decent price on a bike. I use them mainly for parts and tire mounting, since they're 15 mins away. I know, I know, I should the same dealer for both bikes and parts. But I use the best place to provide whatever I looking for. Just like with everything else. But now I found Fred Hink, so......sorry Cycle Motion, lololol. NY Pete ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 06:41:33 -0500 From: "Steamroller" Subject: (klr650) (klr)- dealer rec. oils I've read most, but admitedly not all, the posts about oils, and I honestly might have missed it but, 2 of my local dealer/ parts suppliers have suggested my using Maxima- Maxum-4 synthetic blend 15w50 in my KLR 650. The reasoning you might find a bit unusual.... I'm told I should use this oil because, unlike most people, I actually ride OFF-ROAD! Alot of high RPM, and clutch slipping going on. Imagine that, a dual-purpose actually used like a dual-purpose. Actually I ride, acording to my odometer more than half the time off-road, or about 100 to 125 miles a week, the rest, at this point, just poking around locally. I'm actually thinking of going "full-knobby" on my tires since the street oriented tires just don't cut it. Anywho..... This is what I use, and I think it works pretty well. No problems so far. Any thoughts? NY Pete ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 06:45:51 -0500 From: "Steamroller" Subject: Re: (klr650) bad dealers As a member fo both lists, I see even the Coggers complaining of "lack-of-service", but just like here, the lists represent the best source for all-around support of the bikes we love. And most of us do our own service, buying bikes from the lowest cost dealer, often hundreds of miles away, then buying maintenence parts from a local whom we can deal with. That's just the way it goes I guess. - -----Original Message----- From: Ztib@aol.com To: alarsen@rapidnet.net ; marbach@nucleus.com ; ddroger@travel-net.com ; klr650@lists.xmission.com Date: Thursday, March 18, 1999 10:16 PM Subject: (klr650) bad dealers >It is incredible to me how many incompetent dealers there are in the >motorcycle market in North America. And the bottom line is that it is our >fault for tolerating it. When you have a bad dealer experieice, you should >tell the manager, owner, or both. And you should tell them in person and in >writing. And you should tell the service arm of the manufacture, Kaw, Honda, >BMW, whoever it is. > >We are too tolerant of bad dealers. We need to learn how to do most of the >basics ourselves, just to know the bike is mechanically sound and safe. > >This web site is a great place to post your honest experiences with dealers. >I beleive that the dealers should be named . And we should also post positive >experiences with dealers so that the good ones can be identified and proud. >More dealers should be on line with us. I wonder how the Concours Group guys >handle dealer incompetence. > >Face it, it won't get better until the consumer hurts the dealers pocket book. >If you have a good dealer, treasure him and support him. If you have a bad >dealer, tell him and ask him if he intends to get better in the area that >concerns you. Give him a second chance if you are comfortable. But if he >displays incompetence again, find someone else. > >Mr. Do it yourself > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 08:17:57 EST From: FTabor231@aol.com Subject: Re: (klr650) bearings (NKLR) In a message dated 3/20/99 1:50:07 AM Central Standard Time, msfaul@digisys.net writes: << that while plain bearings are more affected by heavy oil, rollers encounter enough resistance in heavier weight oil as to raise load levels in most applications >> Skip, you're probably right, the point was that a viscosity increase from 10w40 to 15w50 may not significantly affect the KLR as much, however, the cams still run on machined aluminum in the head and we have wet clutches, both operate better with lower viscosity. Frank ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 07:31:55 -0600 From: "J.P.Zucht" Subject: (klr650) pro grip gels ? Arne Larsen wrote: ...the "purple", dimpled Pro-Grip gel grips... I just got sent a set of 'Pro-grip gels' in a 'purple' box, but they have rectangular markings on them. They said they had two kinds, these were about $4. more. Did I get the wrong ones? (...Is there a 'wrong' set ??) Just thought I should ask as I was going to put 'em on this weekend. Yes, it's almost riding time in Saskatchewan!! Oh, ya, how 'bout them 'velcro?' grip heaters? Is that something that wraps AROUND the grips, so can be added at any time? It seemed that there is another type (??) that (I could be wrong here) slipped under the grip (??) so would have to be put on with the grips (??) hungree ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 08:33:23 EST From: FTabor231@aol.com Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR Break In (NKLR) In a message dated 3/20/99 4:32:59 AM Central Standard Time, jlwalk@prodigy.net writes: << Jeff---who should be packing for his trip tomorrow. >> Jeff, have a good trip! usually, a big bore single and twins can glaze their rings when they are lugged and the engine is not revved freely, especially during break-in. The only Moto Guzzi 850 I ever saw that used oil from early stages belonged to an over the road trucker who could not (in clear conscience) rev his bike past 3,000 and always lugged and short shifted. After the second set of rings and a hone, we sent our hot dog wrench out on it to flog it a bit before our trucker got his hands on it again. that did it. Piston rings seal by pressure being exerted on the top and behind the ring, both on compression and deceleration and if the ring grooves get gummed up they won't seal. In the old days we would try some Marvel Mystery oil in the engine and run the cr** out of it, sometimes it worked, sometimes not. Also the soot on your fender may be gas soot if the air cleaner is too heavily oiled or dirty or if there has been rejeting. Frank ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 06:42:32 -0700 From: "Fred Hink" Subject: Re: (klr650) (klr)- dealer rec. oils - -----Original Message----- From: Steamroller To: KLR mailing list Date: Friday, March 19, 1999 9:44 PM Subject: (klr650) (klr)- dealer rec. oils I actually ride >OFF-ROAD! Alot of high RPM, and clutch slipping going on. I'm actually >thinking of going "full-knobby" on my tires since the street oriented tires >just don't cut it. Sounds like you are ready for some Pirelli MT21s on the rear and a Dunlop K139 on the front. This is my tire combination of choice for a DOT knob set-up. Works great and lasts long. Kinda like me on a good day. ;<) Fred ------------------------------ End of klr650-digest V2 #156 ****************************