From: owner-orb-digest@lists.xmission.com (orb-digest) To: orb-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: orb-digest V2 #498 Reply-To: orb-digest Sender: owner-orb-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-orb-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes orb-digest Wednesday, August 8 2001 Volume 02 : Number 498 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 12:28:36 -0700 From: Ed Subject: RE: (orb) bob's You will be able to get them from the same shops that sold them before they were officially available from badorb. Last time I checked they were available from Vinyl Exchange for 10 UKP (they were listed, not sure if still available) Edward # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 12:28:35 -0700 From: Ed Subject: RE: (orb) bob's >I'm not impressed with the packaging. it's a stiff brown card mailer with no padding and no >airspace, and the records are not wrapped in plastic or anything. Pretty standard packaging from the UK. I get 80% of my vinyl from the UK shipped like this. I've been amazed that nothing has ever come damaged. Edward # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 12:34:21 -0700 From: Ed Subject: (orb) FW: Badorb Bob's received Sorry about that Ed, 'tis on its way.... > Bob3 didn't come with the > "Certificate of > Orbthenticity" that the other two came with. > So I have no idea of artist, > track titles > and all the production/mix credits. Any chance > you can send me this > paperwork for Bob3? Badorb has contacted saying they'll send along the paperwork. Customer service seems to be working. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 11:32:33 -0800 (AKDT) From: "James A. Crippen" Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question BTW, anyone can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, or *especially* if there's an easier way. :-) 'james - -- James A. Crippen ,-./-. Anchorage, Alaska, Lambda Unlimited: Recursion 'R' Us | |/ | USA, 61.2069 N, 149.766 W, Y = \f.(\x.f(xx)) (\x.f(xx)) | |\ | Earth, Sol System, Y(F) = F(Y(F)) \_,-_/ Milky Way. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 11:31:27 -0800 (AKDT) From: "James A. Crippen" Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question On Tue, 7 Aug 2001, Benjamin L. May wrote: > The pitch slider tells you changes in PITCH, not in meter, > although what everyone does when the use the pitch control is control the > meter (speed/BPM) of the song... So I need to know if there's some nice > transform like: > > f(y,z) = q > > Where y = the BPM of the song when the pitch slider is at zero and > where z = the current position of the slider relative to the zero position > and q = the actual BPM of the song after pitch adjustment. You should be able to determine this one of two ways. Using statistics, you can take a piece of music that you know to be a certain BPM when played at zero (like something you can beatmatch with an exact copy of the same music on CD or somesuch). Then you determine the change in BPM at the pitch control's maximum and minimum settings. Do this with three or four pieces of music to get a good sized sampling, then chart the values out on a graph and look for a statistical mean line. This line will approximate the function that should represent the change in BPM by the pitch control. The only drawback of this approach is that it is statistical, and only gets more accurate if you increase the size of the sample (the number of records you use for your data). The mean line will most likely be a linear function, ie variable on a power of 1. If it isn't it might be exponential, which would probably be a quadratic function (a power of two). You can make a reasonable assumption that the pitch control isn't any more complicated than a quadratic (x squared) function, since anything more complicated (like a logarithmic change) would be overengineered and a waste of manufacturing money. The other way to go about it requires more math, but should be more accurate. What you will have to do is find a correlation between BPM and RPM. If you can find a manual that tells you what the maximum and minimum RPM (or their percentage differences from zero, 33.5 RPM) are for the pitch control, then you need to calculate how many beats per revolution you have on a particular record. Then just stick in how many revolutions per minute you have and you'll know how many beats you have by eliminating the quantifiers. It's honestly easier than I make it sound. Look back at your college algebra books or the like. Look for related rates problems. See how you convert one rate whose value is unknown but has a known relation to another rate, whose value is known. Then just multiply and remove the quantifiers that cancel each other (like minutes over minutes, etc). You probably did this as homework once in high school or college math. Same sort of thing applies to calculating how fast a person is walking on a surface that is also moving (like those moving sidewalks in airports) when you only know the total speed of movement and the speed of the sidewalk. It gets a lot more interesting when you start dealing with *changing* speed, ie velocity. Or opposing vectors thereof. That gets into some calculus, which I will spare people from... ;-) 'james - -- James A. Crippen ,-./-. Anchorage, Alaska, Lambda Unlimited: Recursion 'R' Us | |/ | USA, 61.2069 N, 149.766 W, Y = \f.(\x.f(xx)) (\x.f(xx)) | |\ | Earth, Sol System, Y(F) = F(Y(F)) \_,-_/ Milky Way. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 15:45:19 -0400 (EDT) From: "Benjamin L. May" Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question Okay, first off I must preface this with a note: I have a BS in computer science, and I took partial and ordinary differential equations as well as statistical methods and analysis, so PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE share the math with me!!! :) I'm a total math buff... > You should be able to determine this one of two ways. Using statistics, My worry tho is that this function will be not nice. You said that it would probably be a line, but I have a feeling that the increase in BPM according to the slider is either a) non-linnear (or worse, differential) or b) extremely dependant upon the initial BPM count (in other words, taking a sample of songs and trying to approximate will probably not work, or at best be very innaccurate). > a quadratic function (a power of two). You can make a reasonable > assumption that the pitch control isn't any more complicated than a > quadratic (x squared) function, since anything more complicated (like a > logarithmic change) would be overengineered and a waste of manufacturing > money. Ahh, but you forget that increases in LOUDNESS are measured logarithmically, because that is the way our ears percieve things (I think this is due to physical characteristic of the inner ear, anyone? :P). I suspect that the output function i'm trying to find is going to be ugly... > The other way to go about it requires more math, but should be more > accurate. What you will have to do is find a correlation between BPM and > RPM. If you can find a manual that tells you what the maximum and minimum > RPM (or their percentage differences from zero, 33.5 RPM) are for the > pitch control, then you need to calculate how many beats per revolution > you have on a particular record. Then just stick in how many revolutions > per minute you have and you'll know how many beats you have by eliminating > the quantifiers. I like this idea better, but again we're faced with the problem that the manual and tech papers list the variance of the pitch slider in units of PITCH! not rpm. :( > Same sort of thing applies to calculating how fast a person is walking on > a surface that is also moving (like those moving sidewalks in airports) > when you only know the total speed of movement and the speed of the > sidewalk. So you're saying I'm going to have to account for the spinning of the earth along its axis in my calculations for pitch!? Just kidding, we all know that's relative movement, as we and everything else on the surface of the planet are happily spinning along with the earth itself. :) > It gets a lot more interesting when you start dealing with *changing* > speed, ie velocity. Or opposing vectors thereof. That gets into some > calculus, which I will spare people from... ;-) You mean IE acceleration. :) # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 15:54:37 -0400 (EDT) From: laerm Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question On Tue, 7 Aug 2001, James A. Crippen wrote: > The mean line will most likely be a linear function, ie variable on a > power of 1. If it isn't it might be exponential, which would probably > be a quadratic function (a power of two). You can make a reasonable > assumption that the pitch control isn't any more complicated than a > quadratic (x squared) function, since anything more complicated (like > a logarithmic change) would be overengineered and a waste of > manufacturing money. this is kinda what i just suggested to ben off-list, along the "well, it may as well be that way, because there's no logical way for it to be any other way" lines. > The other way to go about it requires more math, but should be more > accurate. What you will have to do is find a correlation between BPM > and RPM. If you can find a manual that tells you what the maximum and > minimum RPM (or their percentage differences from zero, 33.5 RPM) are > for the pitch control, then you need to calculate how many beats per > revolution you have on a particular record. Then just stick in how > many revolutions per minute you have and you'll know how many beats > you have by eliminating the quantifiers. hmm. i didn't think about this. this is mathematically easier, but tougher to determine a beats per rpm. actually, wait... shit. i don't have it here with me. there's this thomas brinkmann record that is 133.333 bpm at 33.333 rpm. all it is is kicks, mostly, on the beat. not really for listening, but because of the way it's pressed, you can see the beats when you look at the record (quite a beautiful little piece of art, really). iirc, there are kicks on every 1/4 note and there are 8 kicks visible around the circumference of the record... shit, wait, no, what about the fact that inner grooves are shorter than outer grooves? in that situation, you're going to have less music per revolution. > It gets a lot more interesting when you start dealing with *changing* > speed, ie velocity. Or opposing vectors thereof. That gets into some > calculus, which I will spare people from... ;-) what about a record that's really dirty is spots so the needle runs a bit slower through those sections? or one with an offset center hole? ;) micah stupak /"\ laerm@soulfood.org ascii ribbon campaign \ / international bright young kook against HTML email X / \ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 12:55:42 -0700 From: Chris Johnson Subject: Re: (orb) bob's Ed wrote: > > >I'm not impressed with the packaging. it's a stiff brown card mailer with > no padding and no > >airspace, and the records are not wrapped in plastic or anything. > > Pretty standard packaging from the UK. I get 80% of my vinyl from the UK > shipped like this. > I've been amazed that nothing has ever come damaged. I've had multiple shipments shipped in those crappy UK envelope-style mailers damaged. You'd be amazed at how clueless some otherwise professional shops can be about that sort of thing, particularly for rare/valuable LPs...hello, these are getting shipped halfway around the world, and are odd-shaped and fragile. Even if they don't get thrashed, the envelopes are oversized, and you are going to get seam splits from the vinyl moving around, unless you pack the sleeve and vinyl separately, which of course, no one does; people professional enough to do that don't use those mailers in the first place. Spend the extra .5 ukp for a proper LP mailer; I'll gladly pay for the extra cost and weight. Thankfully, this type of mailer seems to be restricted to the UK, along with the associated insanity of thinking that you can safely ship a 12" in one. To add insult to injury, whenever I have to complain about this sort of thing, I routinely get the "this is the first time that has ever happened". Yeah, right, you've been in business for years, and you haven't had that happen before... Feh. At this point, I'm close to routinely sending packaging instructions to just about everyone I deal with in the UK for vinyl, along with the caveat that I will be seeking a refund if the vinyl or sleeve is damaged due to shoddy packaging. Chris (if my BadOrb 12"s are even slightly damaged due to inferior packaging, you can bet I'll either be getting replacements, or charging the whole damn thing back) # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 16:04:57 -0400 (EDT) From: laerm Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question On Tue, 7 Aug 2001, Benjamin L. May wrote: > Okay, first off I must preface this with a note: I have a BS in > computer science, and I took partial and ordinary differential > equations as well as statistical methods and analysis, so PLEASE > PLEASE PLEASE share the math with me!!! :) I'm a total math buff... oh, man, i'd probably enjoy seeing it, too, even though i haven't touched higher math since school, and i'd be all flustered cuz i couldn't remember things. :) > Ahh, but you forget that increases in LOUDNESS are measured > logarithmically, because that is the way our ears percieve things (I > think this is due to physical characteristic of the inner ear, anyone? > :P). I suspect that the output function i'm trying to find is going to > be ugly... yeah, due to the old fibonacci sequence shape of the cochlea...but how is the loudness applicable to what we're trying to solve? > I like this idea better, but again we're faced with the problem > that the manual and tech papers list the variance of the pitch slider > in units of PITCH! not rpm. :( that sounds like two ideas butting heads. imagine i have a record of a pure sine wave, A3 440Hz (top ten tune, i'm sure). pitch-shifting that 10% will not have the same result (in terms of overall gain in pitch) as pitch-shifting an A2...or will it? man, my head is confused today. :) micah stupak /"\ laerm@soulfood.org ascii ribbon campaign \ / international bright young kook against HTML email X / \ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 21:26:14 +0100 From: Mac Morgan Subject: Re: (orb) (mostly off topic) Air, fake LX flyer & new Aphex I heartily agree. I just got the CD and I haven't been this impressed in a long time. The website is TRES cool, too. http://www.10000hzlegend.com/ 06/07/2001 19:57:28, Emma Peel wrote: >I just got back from Air. I HIGHLY recommend going. A-M-A-Z-I-N-G. They are doing a European tour this fall (London on my birthday- too bad I'll be stuck here). Great sound, great stage presence, cool light show- and of course, kick ass music. > # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Aug 2001 16:31:59 -0700 From: Emma Peel Subject: (orb) drunken New Order, BOBs & east coast USA travel Allo, Sorry for the delayed response but I'm on the digest. The loaded new Order guitarist was Barnie. He was fun to watch. I have recieved no BOBs up in Vancouver. Things take a long time to get here from Europe usually. On another completely different note- I will be heading to New York and maybe Chicago (to catch Squarepusher) next week (Aug 11-20). Any advice on good record & coffee shops would be much appreciated. Have a nice day. __________________________________________________________ Get your FREE personalized e-mail at http://www.canada.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 16:33:25 -0700 (PDT) From: RadiOrb-Not just for Christmas Subject: (orb) BadOrb 2 Different? As I was recording my BadOrb records, I was checking the website to make sure I was playing everything at the right speed. Everything sounded the same to my ears except for BadOrb 2, the Ayumi Hamasaki tracks. Neither side of that record sounded to my ears like the admittedly lo-fi version at Badorb.com. I know they only recenly posted the track listing to this record at the site, so is it possible they had posted the wrong music, also? Anyone else notice this, or are my ears broken? e PS-I figured out that all the sides with one track played at 45 rpm, while all the sides with 2 tracks played at 33. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 16:35:28 -0700 (PDT) From: RadiOrb-Not just for Christmas Subject: (orb) BadOrb 2 Different? As I was recording my BadOrb records, I was checking the website to make sure I was playing everything at the right speed. Everything sounded the same to my ears except for BadOrb 2, the Ayumi Hamasaki tracks. Neither side of that record sounded to my ears like the admittedly lo-fi version at Badorb.com. I know they only recenly posted the track listing to this record at the site, so is it possible they had posted the wrong music, also? Anyone else notice this, or are my ears broken? e PS-I figured out that all the sides with one track played at 45 rpm, while all the sides with 2 tracks played at 33. ===== Listen to RadiOrb at www.Live365.com Internet radio at it's most ambient. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001 20:39:39 -0400 From: rob buse Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question wouldnt it be: variables bpm1, bpm2, pitch1 ( 8% = .08 ), pitch2 we need to match beats, so, for any record, bpm + (bpm * pitch) = bpmfinal (record one) (record two) so: bpm1 + (bpm1 * pitch1) = bpm2 + (bpm2 * pitch2) and since your records would be labeled with bpms, and we have the pitch of the current record playing: bpm1 + (bpm1 * pitch1) = bpm2 + (bpm2 * pitch2) (1 + pitch1) * bpm1 = bpm2 + (bpm2 * pitch2) (1 + pitch1) = ( bpm2 + (bpm2 * pitch2) ) / bpm1 pitch1 = (( bpm2 + (bpm2 * pitch2) ) / bpm1) - 1 assume record two is playing and you need the pitch for one pitch1 = (( bpm2 * (1 + pitch2) ) / bpm1) - 1 I just tried it on my decks and it seems to work. but if you ask me, its not worth your time. i mean, you wont be able to get the precision you need to make a good mix anyhow. I mean, it might be kinda on, but its going to drift into a wreck in a matter of seconds. Your much better off just learning how to mix with your ears. screw the math shit. .buse - ------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.filter24.org music + technology # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 08:57:31 +0800 From: Kael Driscoll Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question > Your much better off >just learning how to mix with your ears. screw the math shit. i agree with this, but it does seem that most people, as they learn to mix with ears, need to bpm their collection to get some idea of where things are... then you abandon it! i know i did... i had my collection bpm-ed for a while, then I just stopped as I learnt to mix with my ears... i think it can be an important step in the right direction... cheers KL # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Aug 2001 20:19:03 -0700 From: Emma Peel Subject: (orb) (off-topic) Squarepusher is cancelling...... I just found out that he cancelled the shows here in Vancouver tonight and Seattle tomorrow. I'm not sure yet what this means for the rest of the tour. Mira Calix & Plaid are still playing- and I get $10 off if I still go (which I will). It still sucks though. It feels like the LX fiasco all over again (except for no imposters). We really are nice here, I swear. __________________________________________________________ Get your FREE personalized e-mail at http://www.canada.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2001 20:40:10 -0700 From: "Nexus" Subject: Re: (orb) badorb/dirty kiss You wrote: Could you please post on the list what color the shirt is, cause you are the first to get it and I think we are all wondering. Thanks, Martin I say: The shirt is dark grey, with the Autolump character ( same as one on the site) in black and white. The back has a small badorb logo up by the collar, black and white also......The t-shirt was wrapped around my records as if to protect them.... Why hasn't anyone else recieved one? I thought it was supposed to come with some sort of certificate of "how to wear your character", i didn't get one. Oh well... cheers - -Chris # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 08:55:28 +0100 From: Matt.Skinner@skanska.co.uk Subject: RE: (orb) bob's >> Last time I checked they were available from Vinyl Exchange for 10 UKP (they were listed, not sure if still available) That's what I was eluding to. I think when I got them they were less than a tenner. Eil also had them, but for 15 quid. MVP have also had them, but cheaper at a fiver. With regards to record packaging, I think it depends on which monkey at the post office gets their hands on them. I've received hundreds of records in the post and [touch wood] never had a broken one. I've had bent covers and scuffed sleeves but no problems with vinyl. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 09:01:38 +0100 From: Matt.Skinner@skanska.co.uk Subject: RE: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question I always thought that it was to do with the dots on the side of the actual turntable - the red light should catch them right. At "normal" RPM i.e. 33/45 the large middle dot stays still, and as you move the pitch up and down one of the other dots start to remain still while the one in the middle moves. I think the manual even tells you the percentages that the different dots refer to. I seem to recall 3.75% somewhere.......so from the percentage you should be able to work it out by subtracting or adding the percentage onto the original BPM. I think this is all cocked into a snooped hat when you start titting around with the screw inside the turntable that makes +/-8 into +/-16 ;-) I tried BPM'ing stuff when I first started, but as someone said you're better off mixing my ear. BPM's are ok when you're trying to find two records to attempt to mix together to try out the theory, but after practice you should be able to dispense with it altogether. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 07:01:44 -0700 From: Tim C Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question > I always thought that it was to do with the dots on the side of the actual > turntable - the red light should catch them right. At "normal" RPM i.e. > 33/45 the large middle dot stays still, and as you move the pitch up and > down one of the other dots start to remain still while the one in the middle > moves. > I think the manual even tells you the percentages that the different dots > refer to. I seem to recall 3.75% somewhere.......so from the percentage you > should be able to work it out by subtracting or adding the percentage onto > the original BPM. Uh, this is labelled on the deck, actually. Usually. At least with 12XXs. > I think this is all cocked into a snooped hat when you start titting around > with the screw inside the turntable that makes +/-8 into +/-16 ;-) This is a really unwise thing to do - makes the pitch control more sensitive and jumpy than it already is. Beat matching v. difficult thusly. > I tried BPM'ing stuff when I first started, but as someone said you're > better off mixing my ear. BPM's are ok when you're trying to find two > records to attempt to mix together to try out the theory, but after practice > you should be able to dispense with it altogether. Sure, there's no other way (barring cheating), but BPMing is important if you actually mix different styles (GASP!!!) so you at least have an idea of what will or won't fit. T # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 07:01:23 -0700 From: Tim C Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question > I always thought that it was to do with the dots on the side of the actual > turntable - the red light should catch them right. At "normal" RPM i.e. > 33/45 the large middle dot stays still, and as you move the pitch up and > down one of the other dots start to remain still while the one in the middle > moves. > I think the manual even tells you the percentages that the different dots > refer to. I seem to recall 3.75% somewhere.......so from the percentage you > should be able to work it out by subtracting or adding the percentage onto > the original BPM. Uh, this is labelled on the deck, actually. Usually. > I think this is all cocked into a snooped hat when you start titting around > with the screw inside the turntable that makes +/-8 into +/-16 ;-) This is a really unwise thing to do - makes the pitch control more sensitive and jumpy than it already is. Beat matching v. difficult thusly. > I tried BPM'ing stuff when I first started, but as someone said you're > better off mixing my ear. BPM's are ok when you're trying to find two > records to attempt to mix together to try out the theory, but after practice > you should be able to dispense with it altogether. Sure, there's no other way (barring cheating), but BPMing is important if you actually mix different styles (GASP!!!) so you at least have an idea of what will or won't fit. T # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 10:12:49 -0400 (EDT) From: "Benjamin L. May" Subject: Re: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question Hah! The math thing I wanted just so that I would have a rough guide. I didn't plan to sit there and do calculations in my head when I was mixing, rather, if I could look at the outputs of the thing for different speeds, I would be able to look at a record and say, "this one is 125 and the one I want to mix in is 143, so I need to pitch down roughly .6." :) # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 15:12:36 +0100 From: Matt.Skinner@skanska.co.uk Subject: RE: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question >>Uh, this is labelled on the deck, actually. Usually. At least with 12XXs. Don't think so. Not on my 1200's anyway. I have +/-8 on the pitch control, but as we established already that's about as much use as a chocolate teapot. >>This is a really unwise thing to do - makes the pitch control more sensitive and jumpy than it already is. Beat matching v. difficult thusly. It may be unwise, but it's worked fine for me over these last 13 years or so. I managed it ok by ear. I'm not so sure both decks are the same, but it doesn't matter because like I say I use my ears. >>Sure, there's no other way (barring cheating), but BPMing is important if you actually mix different styles (GASP!!!) so you at least have an idea of what will or won't fit. I do, and I've managed ok without BPM'ing so far. I don't know about anyone else, but the effort far outweighs the gain....you should have a good feel anyway [if you know your records - in particular the ones you want to play out] what fits into what. Dunno. Different strokes for different folks I guess. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 10:34:13 -0400 (EDT) From: "Benjamin L. May" Subject: RE: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question > anyway [if you know your records - in particular the ones you want to play > out] what fits into what. > > Dunno. Different strokes for different folks I guess. At any rate, I want to TRY seeing if having the BPM counts on the records will help my ability to mix by ear, which I have already developed quite a bit. Why just throw away a perfectly good and possibly quite useful technique just because its not considered the 'optimal' way to mix? Look at like bad boy bill, that fucker uses a laptop to mix all his songs. :) # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 15:37:52 +0100 From: Matt.Skinner@skanska.co.uk Subject: RE: (orb) somewhat OT turntable question >>At any rate, I want to TRY seeing if having the BPM counts on the records will help my ability to mix by ear, which I have already developed quite a bit. Why just throw away a perfectly good and possibly quite useful technique just because its not considered the 'optimal' way to mix? Aye. Like I said about 10 email ago this morning then - it's a good starting point i.e. you can take two [BPM'd] records and try and put the theory of beatmixing into use. You'll find that you can dispense with it fairly soon. As I think I also said this morning. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 10:45:00 -0400 From: "" Subject: Re: (orb) Eclectic DJs (still somewhat off-topic) : Sure, there's no other way (barring cheating), but BPMing is important : if you actually mix different styles (GASP!!!) so you at least have an : idea of what will or won't fit. I don't think that it's too shocking of an idea of the eclectic DJ -- at least to this list -- figuring most if not all dig LX's all-over-board style. However, I know where you're coming from and completely agree. While we're on the subject, what other eclectic DJs are there that you guys know of? here's a few that i follow (besides LX P, of course): DJ Monk (of Rabbit in the Moon & Pimp Juice) Styles range from hard-house, jungle, old-school acid trance, supped-up hip hop, and booty-core (imagine 2 live crew and porn samples over phat ass-shaking basslines). Unreal live shows are usually accompanied by Hallucination on Film. more info: www.hallucination.com DJ Ease (of Nightmares on Wax) I only have one mix of his... his Studio K7!'s dj kicks compilation. However, for anyone how likes hip-hop, funk, soul with a hint of big-beat ... this CD is for you. His work as Nightmares on Wax is also very cool. Very smooth funky jazz-tempo. Jazzanova while not technically a dj but a 6 piece nu-jazz band from austria on Compost Records ... two of the members spin. from what i've heard they usually start in real traditional sounding lounge and jazz pieces and smoothly progress into more modern downtempo stuff. not quite eclectic from the grab as many genres and fuse them together angle, but how many deejays do you know use non-"dance" music for 8 tracks or more in their set... mixing in the traditional fluid modern dj-as-we-know-it style? Jon Carter this guy fuses big-beat, drum and bass, ragga, reggae, hip-hop, rap, and obscure vocal samples into an audio soup that confuses and scares ravers and bangs the head out of elitists of any of the afore mentioned genres. releases worth tracking down: disc 3 of Essential Mix volume 4 (OOP probably) and Live at the Social vol. 2 anyway, that's my take on this thing. I'd like to hear any of your recommendations. : e r i c : visual artist : web producer : www.thezenlab.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 10:56:14 -0400 (EDT) From: "Benjamin L. May" Subject: Re: (orb) Eclectic DJs (still somewhat off-topic) Dude! Gilles Peterson takes the cake on the eclectic DJ front I think. I've seen him spin 4 times, and every time its been different. First time was latin-tinged hard funky house, second time was all jazz (!!!), nothing from after about 1975, third time was half jungle and half hip hop and fourth was a mix of pretty much everything (I heard herbie hancock, ian pooley, james brown, to name a few). He has 2 or 3 mix cds out that are all amazing. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 16:11:21 +0100 From: Mac Morgan Subject: Re: (orb) bob's Got the following from Garphoo... - -------------------------------------------- dear Mac sorry our fault, Bob are on their way with postcard for MP3s (they haven't been deleted - it's a secret page) Garphoo # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 15:55:20 +0100 From: "Dark Eyed Kid" Subject: Re: (orb) Eclectic DJs (still somewhat off-topic) Both Bent and Lemon Jelly have put out some really eclectic mixes of late on BBCs Breezeblock. I would thoroughly recommend the bent mix (which I've recently upped to moresounds) G # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 12:41:37 -0400 From: "" Subject: (orb) Hosting FTP There are at least 3-4 personal FTP site admins on this list. Can you contact me off list about successfully setting up my own FTP site - I have a copy of Serv-U, but i think my cable modem provider (which is TW Road Runner) has measures in place to block this sort of activity. I'm sure it can be gotten around, and from what i was able to actually dig up in Usenet and Google it might be as simple as changing the port number to some arbitrary unblocked assignment, but would like any first hand accounts or gotchas you came across. I tested from the same machine and was able to connect, but i knew then that it was not very indicative of anything substantial. Obviously, My goal would be to give access to the list at large, eventually adding to the number of places people can d/l Orb and related OOP music. thanks in advance~! : e r i c : visual artist : web producer : www.thezenlab.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info orb" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email orb@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ End of orb-digest V2 #498 *************************