From: zorn-list-owner@xmission.com To: zorn-list-digest@xmission.com Subject: zorn-list Digest V2 #39 Reply-To: zorn-list@xmission.com Errors-To: zorn-list-owner@xmission.com Precedence: zorn-list Digest Sunday, 8 December 1996 Volume 02 : Number 039 In this issue: Re: Oswald Re: Oswald Avant CDs Question on Ornette Coleman Re: Avant CDs bar kokhba rustlin' up opinions you slobering donatrixes Re: Avant CDs Away until 12/9 Re: Masada/Filmworks/Bible Launcher/... what? Re: Oswald Cohen and Douglas Tzitzis Re: Eyvind Kang jon's "smoke" Not Re: Oswald Re: Question on Ornette Coleman Re: Tzitzis Re: Bob Ostertag Fwd: Oswald/ klezmers See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the zorn-list or zorn-list-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Robert Pleshar Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 15:19:35 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: Oswald I have the Oswald Pluderphonics Elektra 40th Anniversary disc and I didn't recognize any Naked City in it nor are they listed as a source. As I recall, there's a bunch of stuff from Elektra's vaults: The Doors, Carly Simon, Queen, MC5, Metallica, and (dramatic pause) Faster Pussycat. I'll tape it for folks, but only in 1997 after I move. Things are being packed up right now. Ralph At 02:41 PM 12/6/96 -0500, Seth Gordon wrote: >The Oswald Naked City cut-ups are more than likely part of the "O'Hell" >compilation he put together for Elektra. It was a promo-only release >with a very short run. It featured, I believe, Oswald remixes of the >Doors and Metallica as well. Check the MACOS (Musicians Against the >Copywriting of Samples) homepage... I think there might be a link there >to someone who can tape it for you... > > ------------------------------ From: Joel Kuszai Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 18:21:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Oswald I'm told that in toronto- Oswald plays sax every tuesday as part of CCMC at the Music Gallery, which is in the same building as the magazine Musicworks, which has featured a number of articles on Oswald. Perhaps this is old news. The naked city cut ups I have are on the (ReR) sampler: the most recent one I have seen, in any event. The clip there is only a few seconds long (about a minute) and I ahve always wondered if there was more. Musicworks has produced both cds and tapes with each issue, and I believe two or three of them have included Oswald pieces--some of them startling and different (like the symphonic ones, if I'm remembering correctly) and of couse clips of the Michael Jackson stuff, as well as excerpts from Plunderphonics. The quality of the tapes could be better--but it is good in my estimation. There are exerpts also from the Mystery Tapes, which I believe you can order from Oswald (there is an address, I'd be happy to supply...) There is a memorable sampling of the immigrants song by Led Zepplin with a vocal overlay of a preacher doing a hellfire sermon! there are also weird 45rpm vinyl things floating around: I recently got one in toronto:"John Oswald vs. Change of Heart in the Tummysuckle Ruse" it has several pieces on it and carries on the cover the photo series in which michael jackson has been transformed into michael jackson as a naked woman-- On Fri, 6 Dec 1996, Robert Pleshar wrote: > I have the Oswald Pluderphonics Elektra 40th Anniversary disc and I didn't > recognize any Naked City in it nor are they listed as a source. As I recall, > there's a bunch of stuff from Elektra's vaults: The Doors, Carly Simon, > Queen, MC5, Metallica, and (dramatic pause) Faster Pussycat. > > I'll tape it for folks, but only in 1997 after I move. Things are being > packed up right now. > > Ralph > > > > At 02:41 PM 12/6/96 -0500, Seth Gordon wrote: > >The Oswald Naked City cut-ups are more than likely part of the "O'Hell" > >compilation he put together for Elektra. It was a promo-only release > >with a very short run. It featured, I believe, Oswald remixes of the > >Doors and Metallica as well. Check the MACOS (Musicians Against the > >Copywriting of Samples) homepage... I think there might be a link there > >to someone who can tape it for you... > > > > > > ------------------------------ From: Andrew Batson Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 15:45:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: Avant CDs I noticed that the Japanese Avant label has a CD by George Lewis called Voyager. Is the same George Lewis who played trombone on Zorn's News for Lulu? If it is, I'm all over this CD...And has anyone heard Erik Friedlander's Avant CD? His cello playing on Bar Kokhba is sweet... Tips are appreciated. Andrew ------------------------------ From: martinj@SONOMA.EDU Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 17:00:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: Question on Ornette Coleman Greetings to all on the list. I was thinking of getting some Ornette coleman stuff (Can you believe I don't have any yet?) and I was wondering if anyone could suggest some truly amazing albums. I'd be most thankful. Josh Martin martinj@sonoma.edu ------------------------------ From: "Patrice L. Roussel" Date: Fri, 06 Dec 1996 17:33:14 -0800 Subject: Re: Avant CDs On Fri, 6 Dec 1996 15:45:40 -0800 (PST) Andrew Batson wrote: > > > I noticed that the Japanese Avant label has a CD by George Lewis called > Voyager. Is the same George Lewis who played trombone on Zorn's News for > Lulu? If it is, I'm all over this CD...And has anyone heard Erik ^^^^ Yep (not to be confused with the clarinet player). > Friedlander's Avant CD? His cello playing on Bar Kokhba is sweet... Patrice. ------------------------------ From: kmurren@wesleyan.edu (Keefe Murren) Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 20:46:45 -0500 Subject: bar kokhba Does anyone know who the percusionist was who played with bar kokhba at the knitting factory on oct. 18? It was hard to understand zorn when he introduced him. I think it was Jim Pugilese. ------------------------------ From: Randy Long -- Personal Account Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 20:58:56 -0500 (EST) Subject: rustlin' up opinions you slobering donatrixes Boy, I just grew 19 more iq points and got a web browser. So all you zorn fans/www veterans- what is the best Zorn website out there? Thanks! - -------Sammy ------------------------------ From: mool@sirius.com (Allan Horrocks) Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 20:48:22 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Avant CDs Regarding Andrew Batson's query-->I haven't heard Friedlander's Avant disc, but his more recent Tzadik release is quite excellent - if you liked Bar Kokhba you'll assuredly dig it, it's called "The Watchman". - --Allan, who also would like to know about Friedlander's Avant disc... :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::Allan Horrocks::::::::::::::::::::: :::::: :: ::: ::: :::::::mool@sirius.com::::::::::::::::: :::::: :: ::: ::: ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: :::::: :: ::: :: ::: :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: :::::: H ::: ::O ::: E ::::"Zessenmorri cossin gissowii/:::::: :::::: :: ::: :: ::: ::::::::::::Mekkei mossa meccunna":::::::::: :::::: :: ::: ::: :::::::::::::::::::::::::--Ruins::::::: :::::::::::::::::magazine:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::"Negotiation"::: ------------------------------ From: dsebba@indirect.com Date: Fri, 6 Dec 1996 15:24:26 -0700 (MST) Subject: Away until 12/9 Thank you for your mail! (and yes, I am excited that you wrote). Unfortunatley, I am not in the office at this time, but I will answer your mail as soon as I get back from sunny California. If you have an urgent problem or question regarding your GoSite Server, please contact Customer Service at support@gosite.com (or phone (602) 222-2888). Sorry you aren't on the beach with me, David Sebba ------------------------------ From: Marcus Klein <101370.2613@compuserve.com> Date: 07 Dec 96 07:49:55 EST Subject: Re: Masada/Filmworks/Bible Launcher/... what? >>2. Filmworks 5 & 6 - Are these just as good as Filmworks 2? I >>live by that album! What happened to 3 & 4? Filmworks 5 / Tears of Ecstasy is music for an episode movie, directed by Oki Hiroyuki, which should have about 60 episodes in about 60 minutes. On the CD are 48 tunes, all about 1 minute, and when JZ got that job he had only one day left to record the music. I like it a lot, cause it is very eclectic, and Robert Quine, Marc Ribot, Cyro Baptista and John Zorn probably had much fun, which you can feel listening to this album. Filmworks 6 was done for three movies, Anton, Mailman; Mechanics of the brain and The Black Glove, with totally different music in those movies. My favorite is the score of Anton, Mailman, which gives me that Tarantino-feeling, Hawaiian guitar sound and a bit of what JZ calls it "That Radio City Sound". To my shame I have to say that I did not often listen to the two other scores, because one week ago I bought the DAVID SHEA: HSI-YU CHI album, and today I know that it is one of the 5 best CDs I own. It is music for an imaginary Hong Kong western, and DS deals with many cliches like that typical western guitar sound, but it is so humorous that I could not stop laughing the first time I listened to it. And... when I listened to "Rouge", which features John Zorn on alto, I could not believe how beautiful JZ can play, this is probably the sweetest saxsound I ever heard of John Zorn. 07.12.1996, Marcus Klein Look at this... http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Marcus_Klein_Cologne ------------------------------ From: Brian Carlson Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 11:21:48 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: Oswald At 01:20 PM 12/6/96 -0700, you wrote: >> The Oswald Naked City cut-ups are more than likely part of the "O'Hell" >> compilation he put together for Elektra. It was a promo-only release >> with a very short run. It featured, I believe, Oswald remixes of the >> Doors and Metallica as well. Check the MACOS (Musicians Against the >> Copywriting of Samples) homepage... I think there might be a link there >> to someone who can tape it for you... > >I have this on tape, and there's no Naked City plundered, just the Doors, >Metallica, Tim Buckley, Carly Simon + Faster Pussycat, and MC5 (After writing this post, I added this line. I realized that we are probably talking about two different releases. Nonetheless, I thought some one might find this post of interest.) Are you talking about Rubaiyat, Elektra's 40th Anniversary doulbe album set? On it is a song called T.V. Eye by John Zorn. This song features a great performance by who else but Eye. This sounds like it may be the Naked City crew. Maybe it was recorded and distributed just before their actually adoption of the name Naked City? Also on this collection is a song by Bill Frisell, Robin Holcomb, and Wayne Horvitz. I am quite sure this release is on Patrice's discography. Check it out. Brian ------------------------------ From: Tom Benton Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 14:13:50 -0600 (CST) Subject: Cohen and Douglas Ok, just thought I would toss out a set of questions regarding these two guys. It was certainly more than a year ago, but I remember at some point in the past Masada was doing a few nights at the KF, and each night a different member's band opened. Barondown is pretty common knowledge, but I was curious about the others. One was billed as The Greg Cohen Group, I feel like I've seen a recent ad for the Greg Cohen Sextet, does he possibly have something going on with tzadik soon? The other was Dave Douglas - Sanctuary. I think they played at the What Is Jazz? fest, if I remember correctly the lineup was quite interesting: DD on trumpet, Greg Cohen on bass, and Anthony Coleman on sampler. These instruments were doubled by Japanese musicians whose names I didn't catch. Also a Japanese drummer as well as Chris Speed on tenor sax. So anybody know anything more about these two groups? Thanks all... - -tom- ------------------------------ From: DANIEL BITTON Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 16:13:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: Tzitzis Just some totally unimportant things that I've wondered: Anyone who knows or wishes to theroize is welcome to ponder these mighty issues of our time. - -Why does JZ wear tzitzis under his orange Abracadabra (in Yiddish) T-Shirt that he wears to every show. Is this a new hip-ass style or is he religious or something. - -Why does he wear that same Abracadabra Tshirt to every show? I saw him a year ago, and a month ago and it was the exact same stuff except by now his T-shirt was almost yellow and he had new army pants. On the cover of Big Gundown he's got the same damn tshirt. Is he like Charlie Brown with a closet full of Orange Yiddish Abracadabra tshirts and army pants? - -Where did I come from? ------------------------------ From: "Patrice L. Roussel" Date: Sat, 07 Dec 1996 13:35:27 -0800 Subject: Re: Eyvind Kang On Sat, 30 Nov 1996 21:30:38 +0100 (MET) Torsten Nielsen wrote: > > How many records does Eyvind Kang play on? > I only know "7 NADES" and Frisell's "Quartet", but I remember someone said > something about a record with the Sun City Girls, and a live one where he > improvised. > A few recommendations would be nice... At last, the description of the GILNET record (GILNET was the initial name of this release, renamed eventually as DOGHEAD). It is Greg Gilmore's project (ex. Mother Love Bone) and features musicians from Sun City Girls, Sadhappy, etc. Patrice. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ *** - DOGHEAD: Greg Gilmore 1/ Hargas (R. Hinklin, Gilmore) 2/ The Dog's Head (Gilmore, P. Hinklin) 3/ Roil (Gilmore) 4/ The Wurlitzer (Gilmore, R. Hinklin) 5/ Fourteen (R. Hinklin, Gilmore, Endino) 6/ Budu Voodoo (R. & P. Hinklin, Gilmore) 7/ Humming (Gilmore) 8/ Trebor (Smallwood) 9/ Traction (Endino, Gilmore) 10/ La Zoid (Gilmore) 11/ Sagali (P. & R. Hinklin, Gilmore) 12/ Under (P. Hinklin) 13/ Water (R. Hinklin, Gilmore) 14/ The Loop (Gilmore, P. Hinklin, Kok) (1,2,3) recorded at Word Of Mouth and Music Source (4,5,6,9) recorded at Word Of Mouth (7) recorded at Reciprocal and Art Institute of Seattle (8) recorded at Music Source (10) recorded at Home, Music Source and Ironwood (12) recorded at Art Institute of Seattle (13) recorded at Word Of Mouth and Art Institute of Seattle (14) recorded at Schluckabier's Produced by Greg Gilmore Greg Gilmore: drums, electric drums, sampled percussion, roto tom, samples, bass, electric piano, percussion, guitar, vocals, treatment; Rich Hinklin (1,3,4,5,6,9,11,13): guitar, bass, bass sample, moog, drum loop, vocals, mix; John Bush (1,2,3): congas, real big tambourine, dumbek, frame drum, flute, djembe, water gongs; Paul Hinklin (2,3,6,11,12,13,14): bass, vocals; Kenny Withrow (2): guitar; Scott Johnson (2): vocals; Brendan Wallace (2): trumpet; Dimitri J. (2,5,12): telephone, mix, treatment; Eyvind Kang (3): violin; Jack Endino (5,7,9): memory man bass, drum machine, bass percussion; Robert Smallwood (8): guitar; Phil Ek (9): percussion; Jennifer Gilmore (10): oboe; Keith Lowe (10): bass; Brad Kok (14): guitar, other vocal, bot- tle. 1996 - Cavity Search (USA), CSR 15 (CD) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ From: jk@onyx.interactive.net (jonathan kaye) Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 23:26:28 -0500 Subject: jon's "smoke" for all those in the nyc area, kim's underground has all music on sale 25% off through 12/10. they have 5 or 6 different zorn titles, including 2 masadas (don't remember which ones). i picked up an album by jon called "smoke" on tzadik, executive produced by zorn. anyone know what's up with this. it's a japanese woman playing a pump organ singing in japanese, mostly songs about dogs. now i only gave it a quick once over this afternoon, but i really can't imagine ever listening to it again, unless i'm missing something. i have a feeling she's supposed to be like a japanese daniel johnston, but can you imagine enjoying him singing in japanese? any info anyone has on the disk would be appreciated. anyone going to the early masada sunday at the kf? see you there. jonathan (who usually signs his name "jon" -- but never again) ------------------------------ From: herb@eskimo.com (Herb Levy) Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 02:17:04 -0800 Subject: Not Re: Oswald Since there's been so much interest in John Oswald's work lately, I thought I'd mention a few other folks who use sampling in interesting ways that I never see mentioned here. (David Shea & Christian Marclay do seem to be noticed every once in a while - I'm not neglecting them.) Bob Ostertag has lots of releases that are really great. For reasons that are not limited to copyright concerns, Ostertag usually uses recordings he's made (for instance, Sooner or Later, a great piece made entirely from a recording of a boy burying his father after he'd been killed in El Savador and a small sample of Fred Frith) or he collaborates live with improvisors. Ostertag's most recent work is a complex series of discs that began with him manipulating live performances by a trio of Phil Minton, Mark Dresser, & Gerry Hemingway (voice, bass, & drums, respectively). He then taught these manipulations to the players, who used them as the basis for further improvs. These improvisations were recorded and also manipulated by Ostertag. The process is documented on three discs, In order so far: Say No More (Rec Rec), Say No More In Person (Transit) & Verbatim (Rastascan). The project will end (probably) with Verbatim Live some time in the future. This is already kind of long, but other cool composer/performers who use sampling primarily, if not exclusively, include Carl Stone (recent CDs on New Albion, Emit, & New Tone), Nicolas Collins (Trace Elements), & John Wall (Utter Psalm). Herb Levy herb@eskimo.com ------------------------------ From: john shiurba Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 12:53:26 -0700 Subject: Re: Question on Ornette Coleman martinj@SONOMA.EDU wrote: > > Greetings to all on the list. > I was thinking of getting some Ornette coleman stuff (Can you believe I > don't have any yet?) and I was wondering if anyone could suggest some > truly amazing albums. I'd be most thankful. start with the Atlantic stuff. there's a box set called "Beauty Is A Rare Thing" that is pretty affordable considering how much incredible music is on it. If you don't want to spend that much, you can get the albums individually. My favorites are "The Shape of Jazz to Come" and "This is our Music" - -- shiurba@sfo.com http://www.sfo.com/~shiurba ------------------------------ From: "Patrice L. Roussel" Date: Sun, 08 Dec 1996 14:14:07 -0800 Subject: Re: Tzitzis On Sat, 7 Dec 1996 16:13:50 -0500 (EST) DANIEL BITTON wrote: > > > Just some totally unimportant things that I've wondered: > Anyone who knows or wishes to theroize is welcome to ponder these > mighty issues of our time. > > -Why does JZ wear tzitzis under his orange Abracadabra (in Yiddish) T-Shirt > that he wears to every show. Is this a new hip-ass style or is he > religious or something. > -Why does he wear that same Abracadabra Tshirt to every show? I saw him a > year ago, and a month ago and it was the exact same stuff except by now > his T-shirt was almost yellow and he had new army pants. On the cover of > Big Gundown he's got the same damn tshirt. Is he like Charlie Brown with > a closet full of Orange Yiddish Abracadabra tshirts and army pants? > -Where did I come from? Check the FAQ. Patrice. ------------------------------ From: Christopher Hamilton Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 21:44:31 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Bob Ostertag On Sun, 8 Dec 1996, Herb Levy wrote: > Ostertag's most recent work is a complex series of discs that began with > him manipulating live performances by a trio of Phil Minton, Mark Dresser, > & Gerry Hemingway (voice, bass, & drums, respectively). He then taught > these manipulations to the players, who used them as the basis for further > improvs. These improvisations were recorded and also manipulated by > Ostertag. The process is documented on three discs, In order so far: Say > No More (Rec Rec), Say No More In Person (Transit) & Verbatim (Rastascan). > The project will end (probably) with Verbatim Live some time in the future. I just bought _Verbatim_ and I'm enjoying it tremendously, but I admit I'm dubious about the concept for this sequence. How different are _Say No More_ and _Say No More In Person_ from one another? My understanding is that the latter is just a performance of the score embodied by the former. Is this right? If so, is the difference between the two largely conceptual? Chris Chris Hamilton Dept. of Philosophy University of Pittsburgh Pittsburgh, PA USA ------------------------------ From: Wlt4@aol.com Date: Sun, 8 Dec 1996 22:05:42 -0500 Subject: Fwd: Oswald/ In a message dated 96-12-07 12:30:51 EST, bcarlson@midway.uchicago.edu (Brian Carlson) writes: << Are you talking about Rubaiyat, Elektra's 40th Anniversary doulbe album set? On it is a song called T.V. Eye by John Zorn. This song features a great performance by who else but Eye. This sounds like it may be the Naked City crew. Maybe it was recorded and distributed just before their actually >> - --------------------- Forwarded message: From: bcarlson@midway.uchicago.edu (Brian Carlson) Sender: owner-zorn-list@xmission.com To: zorn-list@xmission.com Date: 96-12-07 12:30:51 EST At 01:20 PM 12/6/96 -0700, you wrote: >> The Oswald Naked City cut-ups are more than likely part of the "O'Hell" >> compilation he put together for Elektra. It was a promo-only release >> with a very short run. It featured, I believe, Oswald remixes of the >> Doors and Metallica as well. Check the MACOS (Musicians Against the >> Copywriting of Samples) homepage... I think there might be a link there >> to someone who can tape it for you... > >I have this on tape, and there's no Naked City plundered, just the Doors, >Metallica, Tim Buckley, Carly Simon + Faster Pussycat, and MC5 (After writing this post, I added this line. I realized that we are probably talking about two different releases. Nonetheless, I thought some one might find this post of interest.) Are you talking about Rubaiyat, Elektra's 40th Anniversary doulbe album set? On it is a song called T.V. Eye by John Zorn. This song features a great performance by who else but Eye. This sounds like it may be the Naked City crew. Maybe it was recorded and distributed just before their actually adoption of the name Naked City? Also on this collection is a song by Bill Frisell, Robin Holcomb, and Wayne Horvitz. I am quite sure this release is on Patrice's discography. Check it out. Brian ------------------------------ From: jnschust@sas.upenn.edu (Joshua N Schuster) Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 01:43:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: klezmers My first post to the list, and not just Zorn related, so I'll first pay dues of legitimacy w. some comments. I caught two Masada shows this fall and find Zorn to be even improving at playing saxophone. He seems more relaxed both at hearing himself better and at involving himself with the rest of the band. As always, Masada is brilliant at dynamics. At a show in Philly the band played one of the "funnier" pieces with quick change and festive cackling, all smiling. Then, with hardly any break, Dave Douglas started a very beautiful and morose solo introduction to "Kedem". It was the first time I heard the song, and after laughing lightheaded at the first song, I was floored into a sort of awe, straining to hear (in a way that one can't stare at music). Douglas stepped back from the mic, muted his trumpet, and brought a powerful sense of distance and we were both straining. I think that strain is a great part of that song, and doesn't come across on the album (one can just adjust the volume). Masada also played a song which had Baron play a plain marching drum beat, somewhat evocative of a military cadence. I couldn't help but jump to wonder what the song's relationship to the mideast situation might be--not that there is a necessary connection, but it seems like an additional way of hearing. The melody was not an outright patriotic heroism but seemed more like both a reminder and a remainder of some conflicts. Also just happened to be in NY for thanksgiving and caught the premiere of "Duras" -dedicated to Marguerite Duras probably. I couldn't hear all of the line-up, but since no one else has responded to the evening, I'll mention: a middle-aged woman on piano, Zeena Parkins on keyboards, Parkin's younger sister (I think?) on violin, Marc Feldman on violin, a woman whose name I didn't catch on assorted percussions, and Jim Pugliese on percussions. The pieces were very quieting, even some rain sound effects were used for dampening. Playing was sparse and thin and fluid. Zorn can make really loud music which is exhausting, but he can do the same with very soft music too; I left and I was fatigued (which was beautiful). Anyways, that's my introductory take. I just have one question I was hoping some of the list-members in NY could help me with: What klezmer clubs would you recommend in NY? I hear there are some lively music clubs in the jewish areas of Bronx and/or Brooklyn, but don't know really what is out there, what people find interesting. Surely not much like Masada, but I'd like to hear some other involvements in klezmer music. Could someone describe the various venues? many thanks, Joshua Schuster ------------------------------ End of zorn-list Digest V2 #39 ****************************** To subscribe to zorn-list Digest, send the command: subscribe zorn-list-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@xmission.com". 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