Go to Jeff Salisbury LWGate Home Page.From: "Katherine Malm" <kmalm@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] LNOP (was Tomorrow -off topic)
Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2002 08:20:26 -0500
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I don't see the discussion of LNOP as off-topic, instead I see it as an =
opportunity to practice the CANSLIM discipline. I've always believed =
that what you *don't* buy is often more important than what you *do* =
buy. Part of knowing what's worthy of an investment with your risk =
capital is to have a disciplined approach to evaluating each potential =
investment, and the CANSLIM list is a good place to practice. Following =
that discipline without exception makes the difference between OK and =
excellent returns, because that methodical process eliminates every =
emotional dark turn from your decision making. While it may seem that =
folks will post nothing but negative about a particular stock, it's =
important to have a methodology that weighs the pros and cons and then =
gives you a process to determine if the final weight is favorable given =
the risk/reward tradeoff. In the end, there's not a single investment =
decision that won't have odds. You stack those odds in your favor as =
best you can and then take the plunge. But.....odds also imply that, =
even if you've followed a discipline to the letter, there's *still* a =
chance that it will work against you. Discipline then takes over when =
you are forced to let go and move on to an alternative.
While were talking psychology, I'll just answer your question about "the =
mass investor thing" by saying that it is more important to know what =
*is* than *why* it is. Chart patterns are formed because folks on the =
way up have differing objectives. Some have been in for a while and are =
simply taking their profits and moving on to another investment, some =
are taking money out of the stock because they know something about the =
business/company/industry/market that others haven't yet perceived, =
still others are fearful that they'll miss the boat or that they'll lose =
their profits if they overstay their welcome. That causes a correction =
of some sort. If there is another group of investors willing to step up =
to the plate, then the stock will form some sort of consolidation, set =
up and keep moving on. If there is not, then the stock falls. I wouldn't =
obsess about the why's, just the how-to's.
Katherine
----- Original Message -----=20
From: zillagirl=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 6:04 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] LNOP (was Tomorrow -off topic)
Thank you Katherine-that's why I went off topic. He requested opinions =
earlier and it interested me so I gave one. Is this o.k., to go off =
topic or is it necessary to word it in a canslim type format as you =
did? Also could I request your opinion on something. I sent a post this =
morning about a W chart-I believe you sent the chart through. The =
charts and volume thing is driving me nuts because I'm not seeing it. I =
saw a run up and a shake out - a run up and a shake out. Do you have =
any advice or thoughts as to why and what to do-or do you see the same =
thing at all? I don't understand the mass investor thing that makes a W =
or triple bottom happen like I do the cup with a handle. I was hoping to =
get a response but didn't, because I'm frustrated by it. But if no =
thoughts on how to help, appreciate your time. Thanks Nancy
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Katherine Malm=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 3:42 PM
Subject: [CANSLIM] LNOP (was Tomorrow -off topic)
Donald & Nancy,
Here are the only facts you need to see this is a stinky stock...
Cashflow NEGATIVE
Earnings NEGATIVE (never had a positive year)
Growth in Sales NEGATIVE
RS 42 and DECLINING
Price LESS THAN 50 and 200 day moving averages
Research is one thing if you want to be "in the know" on a =
technology with "potential"....but the only way to make (and keep) real =
money over the long run is to stick to a discipline and this stock meets =
absolutely zero CANSLIM criteria. If this were a short term trading =
forum, then we'd be having an different discussion about an entirely =
different discipline.
Katherine
----- Original Message -----=20
From: zillagirl=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 5:04 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Tomorrow -off topic
Donald-I did a little checking on LNOP when I read your post. I am =
always interested in new products and in some cases will buy in and wait =
for the business to develop and the fundamentals to improve, to buy low. =
Apparently EZ Chip won the award for the most highly integrated 10 =
Gigabit network processor. This company is a subsidiary of Lan =
Optics(semi conductor company). Lan optics holding in EZ Chip was just =
increased from 57% to 66 % by issuing Apax-a venture capitalist co. who =
held the shares- 1.2 million newly issued shares of Lan Optics, for =
their additional stake. The EZ Chip is suppose to save time and money of =
up to 80%. I have three things that kept me from going further and =
checking acc.-roe-rs etc. 1).Possible dilution of Lan Optic share by 1.2 =
million. 2) They are not anticipating sales to affect revenues for =
apx. 1 year. 3) Semis not shining lately .I appreciate your bringing it =
to my attention and I will follow it , but I think with the market like =
it is there may be a better buy in opportunity closer to when company =
starts to grow from the new product. But I could be just as wrong as =
right. I got my research from T.D. Waterhouse web site. Good Luck with =
it. nancy
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Donald Wallker=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 2:21 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Tomorrow=20
I'm so glad to hear from someone in the thick of things that =
tells me that emotions, rather than hide-bound calculations ,rule the =
day in the market. In truth, I'd rather take a risk, based on the =
sentiment of the marketplace together with some reasonable input, than =
to always hang my hat on CANSLIM. For example, early this morning I =
came within a hair of buying into AYE, not because I thought it was a =
great investment but because, at the opening bell it was paying close to =
%10 in dividends and I knew in my heart that that would not last. =
Rather, I thought I could easily take a %10 to %15 profit by buying =
early and selling late today, since, no doubt, the brokers would be =
pushing the stock. As it turned out, the ere was more that %10 =
invloved However, I found a potentially more favorable, but =
admittedly longer term investment, that is, LNOP. for less that its =
closing price. I'd rather run a risk for a %500 gain than c\to =
ontinuously rake in %10 plus gains. It's all a matter of perspective =
- ------ Donald=20
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Fred Richards=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 4:46 PM
Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] Tomorrow=20
Heck, it was just the wise guys pushing the market up at the =
end. Check the volume. Today was month end and they were trying to =
pretty up things. The turnaround looks very suspicious from my =
perspective particularly as almost all of the recent ones have occurred =
after 3 p.m. in NY including this one.
For me, I'll look at what the overseas markets are doing and =
the pre-market NASDAQ indicator before getting too excited. Further =
more, they were substantially more new lows than new highs for both the =
NYSE and the NASDAQ.=20
But emotions, not facts, rule markets even among the big =
players.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com =
[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Donald Wallker
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2002 3:06 PM
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com
Subject: [CANSLIM] Tomorrow=20
"Tomorrow, tomorrow, there's always tomorrow, it's only a =
day away." And I suspect that it will be a be a Bull day tomorrow =
given the turn-around in todays trading. At this writing we are not yet =
closed, but we are far, far up from today's earlier market weakness, =
which normally bodes well for tomorrow. So-- to everyone in the Group i =
bid you a Happy Tomorrow! - - Donald=20
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<DIV>I don't see the discussion of LNOP as off-topic, instead I see it =
as an=20
opportunity to practice the CANSLIM discipline. I've always believed =
that what=20
you *don't* buy is often more important than what you *do* buy. Part of =
knowing=20
what's worthy of an investment with your risk capital is to have a =
disciplined=20
approach to evaluating each potential investment, and the CANSLIM list =
is a good=20
place to practice. Following that discipline without exception makes the =
difference between OK and excellent returns, because that methodical =
process=20
eliminates every emotional dark turn from your decision making. While it =
may=20
seem that folks will post nothing but negative about a particular stock, =
it's=20
important to have a methodology that weighs the pros and cons and then =
gives you=20
a process to determine if the final weight is favorable given the =
risk/reward=20
tradeoff. In the end, there's not a single investment decision that =
won't have=20
odds. You stack those odds in your favor as best you can and then take =
the=20
plunge. But.....odds also imply that, even if you've followed a =
discipline to=20
the letter, there's *still* a chance that it will work against you. =
Discipline=20
then takes over when you are forced to let go and move on to an=20
alternative.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>While were talking psychology, I'll just answer your question about =
"the=20
mass investor thing" by saying that it is more important to know what =
*is* than=20
*why* it is. Chart patterns are formed because folks on the way up have=20
differing objectives. Some have been in for a while and are simply =
taking their=20
profits and moving on to another investment, some are taking money out =
of the=20
stock because they know something about the =
business/company/industry/market=20
that others haven't yet perceived, still others are fearful that they'll =
miss=20
the boat or that they'll lose their profits if they overstay their =
welcome. That=20
causes a correction of some sort. If there is another group of investors =
willing=20
to step up to the plate, then the stock will form some sort of =
consolidation,=20
set up and keep moving on. If there is not, then the stock falls. I =
wouldn't=20
obsess about the why's, just the how-to's.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Katherine</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dzillagirl@email.msn.com=20
href=3D"mailto:zillagirl@email.msn.com">zillagirl</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 31, 2002 =
6:04=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] LNOP =
(was Tomorrow=20
-off topic)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thank you Katherine-that's why I went =
off topic.=20
He requested opinions earlier and it interested me so I gave one. Is =
this=20
o.k., to go off topic or is it necessary to word it in a canslim =
type=20
format as you did? Also could I request your opinion on =
something. I=20
sent a post this morning about a W chart-I believe you sent the chart=20
through. The charts and volume thing is driving me nuts because =
I'm not=20
seeing it. I saw a run up and a shake out - a run up and a shake =
out. Do you have any advice or thoughts as to why and what to =
do-or do=20
you see the same thing at all? I don't understand the mass =
investor=20
thing that makes a W or triple bottom happen like I do the cup with a =
handle.=20
I was hoping to get a response but didn't, because I'm frustrated =
by it.=20
But if no thoughts on how to help, appreciate your time. Thanks=20
Nancy</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dkmalm@earthlink.net =
href=3D"mailto:kmalm@earthlink.net">Katherine=20
Malm</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 31, =
2002 3:42=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [CANSLIM] LNOP (was =
Tomorrow=20
-off topic)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Donald & Nancy,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Here are the only facts you need to see this is a stinky =
stock...</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Cashflow NEGATIVE</DIV>
<DIV>Earnings NEGATIVE (never had a positive year)</DIV>
<DIV>Growth in Sales NEGATIVE</DIV>
<DIV>RS 42 and DECLINING</DIV>
<DIV>Price LESS THAN 50 and 200 day moving averages</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Research is one thing if you want to be "in the know" on a =
technology=20
with "potential"....but the only way to make (and keep) real money =
over the=20
long run is to stick to a discipline and this stock meets=20
absolutely zero CANSLIM criteria. If this were a short term =
trading=20
forum, then we'd be having an different discussion about an entirely =
different discipline.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Katherine</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dzillagirl@email.msn.com=20
href=3D"mailto:zillagirl@email.msn.com">zillagirl</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 31, =
2002 5:04=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] =
Tomorrow -off=20
topic</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Donald-I did a little checking on =
LNOP when I=20
read your post. I am always interested in new products and in some =
cases=20
will buy in and wait for the business to develop and the =
fundamentals to=20
improve, to buy low. Apparently EZ Chip won the award for the =
most=20
highly integrated 10 Gigabit network processor. This company =
is a=20
subsidiary of Lan Optics(semi conductor company). Lan optics =
holding in EZ=20
Chip was just increased from 57% to 66 % by issuing Apax-a venture =
capitalist co. who held the shares- 1.2 million newly issued =
shares of Lan=20
Optics, for their additional stake. The EZ Chip is suppose to save =
time=20
and money of up to 80%. I have three things that kept =
me from=20
going further and checking acc.-roe-rs etc. 1).Possible dilution =
of Lan=20
Optic share by 1.2 million. 2) They =
are not=20
anticipating sales to affect revenues for apx. 1 year. 3) =
Semis not=20
shining lately .I appreciate your bringing it to my attention and =
I will=20
follow it , but I think with the market like it is there may be a =
better=20
buy in opportunity closer to when company starts to grow from the =
new=20
product. But I could be just as wrong as right. I got my =
research=20
from T.D. Waterhouse web site. Good Luck with it. =20
nancy</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Ddougald@dmv.com =
href=3D"mailto:dougald@dmv.com">Donald=20
Wallker</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 31, =
2002 2:21=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] =
Tomorrow=20
</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I'm so glad to hear from =
someone in the=20
thick of things that tells me that emotions, =
rather than=20
hide-bound calculations ,rule the day in the =
market. =20
In truth, I'd rather take a risk, based on the sentiment of the=20
marketplace together with some reasonable input, than to always =
hang my=20
hat on CANSLIM. For example, early this morning =
I came=20
within a hair of buying into AYE, not because I thought it was a =
great=20
investment but because, at the opening bell it was =
paying close to=20
%10 in dividends and I knew in my heart that that =
would not=20
last. Rather, I thought I could easily take a %10 to %15=20
profit by buying early and selling late today, since, no =
doubt,=20
the brokers would be pushing the stock. As it turned out, =
the ere=20
was more that %10 invloved However, I found a=20
potentially more favorable, but admittedly longer =
term=20
investment, that is, LNOP. for less that its closing price. I'd =
rather=20
run a risk for a %500 gain than c\to ontinuously rake in %10 =
plus=20
gains. It's all a matter of =
perspective ------ Donald=20
</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dadrich@gte.net href=3D"mailto:adrich@gte.net">Fred =
Richards</A>=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July =
31, 2002=20
4:46 PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [CANSLIM] =
Tomorrow=20
</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D000053820-31072002><FONT face=3DArial =
color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2>Heck, it was just the wise guys pushing the market up =
at the=20
end. Check the volume. Today was month end and they were =
trying to=20
pretty up things. The turnaround looks very suspicious =
from my=20
perspective particularly as almost all of the recent ones have =
occurred after 3 p.m. in NY including this =
one.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D000053820-31072002></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D000053820-31072002><FONT face=3DArial =
color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2>For me, I'll look at what the overseas markets are =
doing and=20
the pre-market NASDAQ indicator before getting too excited. =
Further=20
more, they were substantially more new lows than new highs for =
both=20
the NYSE and the NASDAQ. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D000053820-31072002><FONT face=3DArial =
color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D000053820-31072002><FONT face=3DArial =
color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2>But emotions, not facts, rule markets even among the =
big=20
players.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr =
align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>=20
owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]<B>On Behalf Of =
</B>Donald=20
Wallker<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, July 31, 2002 3:06=20
PM<BR><B>To:</B> =
canslim@lists.xmission.com<BR><B>Subject:</B>=20
[CANSLIM] Tomorrow <BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"Tomorrow, tomorrow, =
there's always=20
tomorrow, it's only a day away." And I suspect =
that it=20
will be a be a Bull day tomorrow given the turn-around in =
todays=20
trading. At this writing we are not yet closed, but we =
are=20
far, far up from today's earlier market =
weakness, which=20
normally bodes well for tomorrow. So-- to everyone in=20
the Group i bid you a Happy Tomorrow! - -=20
=
Donald </FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQU=
OTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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