Re: [CANSLIM] CVH

From: "david frank" <camelot.homes@charter.net>
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] CVH
Date: Mon, 19 Aug 2002 14:48:14 -0500
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Lin, it is probably not best to trade ECN's for listed stocks. the order =
flow is not there. when you trade NYSE stocks a specialist handles your =
order And a specialist handles trades-usually-for more than one company. =
david
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Lin Wells=20
  To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
  Sent: Monday, August 19, 2002 2:31 PM
  Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] CVH




  This is an interesting conversation.  I am not sure what "Island" and =
"ECN's" are.  If you have the time to enlighten me it would be much =
appreciated.



  Thanks,



  -----Original Message-----
  From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com =
[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of david frank
  Sent: Monday, August 19, 2002 2:31 PM
  To: canslim@lists.xmission.com
  Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] CVH



  Ed, I appreciate your Americana theme. But what happened in CVH today =
is not a good thing. Of course you probably part of the old buddy system =
of brokers protecting each other. But filing complaints is a heck of a =
lot better than facing litigation. david=20


  =20



    Ed, why suggest malfeasance and not file a complaint?=20

    ----- Original Message -----=20

    From: Gene Ricci=20

    To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20

    Sent: Monday, August 19, 2002 2:10 PM

    Subject:=20





      ----- Original Message -----=20

      From: Edward W. Gjertsen II=20

      To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20

      Sent: Monday, August 19, 2002 1:56 PM

      Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] CVH



      We had our representative on the NYSE floor go and speak with the
      specialist - he hid behind "order imbalance" - floor rules.  We =
were
      asked if we wanted to file a complaint - we decided no.  There =
will be
      many more battles like this.  What is does do is make us look at
      alternatives.  Like I mentioned in an earlier post - Island and =
other
      ECN's would have given us a fill around 32.50.  So we are =
exploring our
      execution options.  Our CANSLIM philosophy is broken down into =
three
      simple parts: Analysis, Money Management and Execution.  This =
time, the
      3rd element, execution, was the weakest link.  So , instead of
      complaining about it, we are doing what American's do best, head =
to the
      competition with a better product.

      Ed Gjertsen II
      ed@macktracks.com

      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com
      [mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of david frank
      Sent: Monday, August 19, 2002 1:29 PM
      To: canslim@lists.xmission.com
      Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] CVH

      I got caught in this so-called CVH inbalanced. luckily i had a =
limit
      order
      in place. although limit orders don't work sometimes- because they =
don't
      have to execute limit orders, although they are within the price =
window.
      of
      course. there were too many eyes on CVH. i was curious what kind =
of
      remedy
      is there for this specialist's malfeasance, especially for buyers =
@
      34.50
      and above- more than 10 minutes after placing their market orders. =
david
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Edward W. Gjertsen II" <ed@macktracks.com>
      To: <canslim@lists.xmission.com>
      Sent: Monday, August 19, 2002 11:36 AM
      Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] CVH


      > One of the risks with CANSLIM -  too many investors ready to =
pounce on
      > too few stocks.  We have been stalking CVH for quite a while.  =
We put
      in
      > an order prior to it reaching its pivot (cheating) when NYSE on =
level
      > two showed $32.40 offer.  As CANSLIMR's moved in to buy - the
      specialist
      > did not open the book until $34.50.  The specialist claimed =
"order
      > imbalance" but my source at Pershing said he was working another =
book.
      > We were quite upset  The stock moved over $2.00 on an imbalance =
of
      > 110,000 shs.  The market maker was caught flatfooted.  We =
quickly sold
      > out of our position because we were over the 5% threshold.
      >
      > Those trading Island or other ECN's may have been filled around
      > 32.40-32.50.  We watch Time and Sales on all our fills and the =
only
      > prints were coming from ECN's.  With CANSLIM being one of the =
most
      > popular strategies for individual investors, execution is =
becoming
      more
      > and more difficult.
      >
      > Ed Gjertsen II
      > ed@macktracks.com
      >
      >
      > -
      > -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com"
      > -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or
      > -"unsubscribe canslim".  Do not use quotes in your email.


      -
      -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com"
      -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or
      -"unsubscribe canslim".  Do not use quotes in your email.


      -
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      -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or
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<BODY lang=3DEN-US vLink=3Dblue link=3Dblue bgColor=3Dwhite>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Lin, it is probably not best to trade =
ECN's for=20
listed stocks. the order flow is not there. when you trade NYSE stocks a =

specialist handles your order And a specialist handles =
trades-usually-for more=20
than one company. david</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=3Dlinwells1@charter.net =
href=3D"mailto:linwells1@charter.net">Lin=20
  Wells</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
 </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, August 19, 2002 =
2:31=20
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [CANSLIM] =
CVH</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV class=3DSection1>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial color=3Dnavy size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial color=3Dnavy size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">This is an=20
  interesting conversation.&nbsp; I am not sure what =
&#8220;Island&#8221; and &#8220;ECN&#8217;s&#8221;=20
  are.&nbsp; If you have the time to enlighten me it would be much=20
  appreciated.</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial color=3Dnavy size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial color=3Dnavy size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Thanks,</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial color=3Dnavy size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3DTahoma =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">-----Original=20
  Message-----<BR><B><SPAN style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> =
<A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com">owner-canslim@lists.xmis=
sion.com</A>=20
  [mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com] <B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>david =
frank<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Monday, August 19, 2002 =
2:31=20
  PM<BR><B><SPAN style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> <A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [CANSLIM]=20
  CVH</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3D"Times =
New Roman"=20
  size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Ed, I appreciate your =
Americana=20
  theme. But what happened in CVH today is not a good thing. Of course =
you=20
  probably part of the old buddy system of brokers protecting each =
other. But=20
  filing complaints is a heck of a lot better than facing litigation. =
david=20
  </SPAN></FONT></P>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><BR></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P></DIV></DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE=20
  style=3D"BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: =
medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt =
3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: =
medium none">
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
    size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
12pt"></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
    size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Comic Sans =
MS'">Ed, why=20
    suggest&nbsp;malfeasance&nbsp;and not file a complaint? =
</SPAN></FONT></P>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">----- Original Message =
- -----=20
    </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV style=3D"font-color: black">
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; MARGIN-LEFT: =
0.5in"><B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <A=20
    title=3Dgenr@swbell.net href=3D"mailto:genr@swbell.net">Gene =
Ricci</A>=20
    </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
    size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">To:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <A=20
    title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
    =
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
    </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
    size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Sent:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> Monday,=20
    August 19, 2002 2:10 PM</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
    size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Subject:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">=20
    </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
    size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
12pt"></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
    size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
12pt"></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P></DIV>
    <BLOCKQUOTE=20
    style=3D"BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: =
medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt =
3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: =
medium none">
      <DIV>
      <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
      size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">----- =
Original=20
      Message ----- </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
      <DIV style=3D"font-color: black">
      <P class=3DMsoNormal=20
      style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
      size=3D2><SPAN=20
      style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
      face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <A=20
      title=3Ded@macktracks.com href=3D"mailto:ed@macktracks.com">Edward =
W. Gjertsen=20
      II</A> </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
      <DIV>
      <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
      size=3D2><SPAN=20
      style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">To:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
      face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <A=20
      title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
      =
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
      </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
      <DIV>
      <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
      size=3D2><SPAN=20
      style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Sent:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
      face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">=20
      Monday, August 19, 2002 1:56 PM</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
      <DIV>
      <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
      size=3D2><SPAN=20
      style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Subject:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
      face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> RE:=20
      [CANSLIM] CVH</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
      <DIV>
      <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
      size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
12pt"></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P></DIV>
      <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
      size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">We had our representative =
on the NYSE=20
      floor go and speak with the<BR>specialist - he hid behind "order=20
      imbalance" - floor rules.&nbsp; We were<BR>asked if we wanted to =
file a=20
      complaint - we decided no.&nbsp; There will be<BR>many more =
battles like=20
      this.&nbsp; What is does do is make us look =
at<BR>alternatives.&nbsp; Like=20
      I mentioned in an earlier post - Island and other<BR>ECN's would =
have=20
      given us a fill around 32.50.&nbsp; So we are exploring =
our<BR>execution=20
      options.&nbsp; Our CANSLIM philosophy is broken down into =
three<BR>simple=20
      parts: Analysis, Money Management and Execution.&nbsp; This time,=20
      the<BR>3rd element, execution, was the weakest link.&nbsp; So , =
instead=20
      of<BR>complaining about it, we are doing what American's do best, =
head to=20
      the<BR>competition with a better product.<BR><BR>Ed Gjertsen =
II<BR><A=20
      =
href=3D"mailto:ed@macktracks.com">ed@macktracks.com</A><BR><BR>-----Origi=
nal=20
      Message-----<BR>From: <A=20
      =
href=3D"mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com">owner-canslim@lists.xmis=
sion.com</A><BR>[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]=20
      On Behalf Of david frank<BR>Sent: Monday, August 19, 2002 1:29 =
PM<BR>To:=20
      <A=20
      =
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
<BR>Subject:=20
      Re: [CANSLIM] CVH<BR><BR>I got caught in this so-called CVH =
inbalanced.=20
      luckily i had a limit<BR>order<BR>in place. although limit orders =
don't=20
      work sometimes- because they don't<BR>have to execute limit =
orders,=20
      although they are within the price window.<BR>of<BR>course. there =
were too=20
      many eyes on CVH. i was curious what kind of<BR>remedy<BR>is there =
for=20
      this specialist's malfeasance, especially for buyers =
@<BR>34.50<BR>and=20
      above- more than 10 minutes after placing their market orders.=20
      david<BR>----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Edward W. Gjertsen =
II"=20
      &lt;<A =
href=3D"mailto:ed@macktracks.com">ed@macktracks.com</A>&gt;<BR>To:=20
      &lt;<A=20
      =
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
&gt;<BR>Sent:=20
      Monday, August 19, 2002 11:36 AM<BR>Subject: RE: [CANSLIM]=20
      CVH<BR><BR><BR>&gt; One of the risks with CANSLIM -&nbsp; too many =

      investors ready to pounce on<BR>&gt; too few stocks.&nbsp; We have =
been=20
      stalking CVH for quite a while.&nbsp; We put<BR>in<BR>&gt; an =
order prior=20
      to it reaching its pivot (cheating) when NYSE on level<BR>&gt; two =
showed=20
      $32.40 offer.&nbsp; As CANSLIMR's moved in to buy -=20
      the<BR>specialist<BR>&gt; did not open the book until =
$34.50.&nbsp; The=20
      specialist claimed "order<BR>&gt; imbalance" but my source at =
Pershing=20
      said he was working another book.<BR>&gt; We were quite =
upset&nbsp; The=20
      stock moved over $2.00 on an imbalance of<BR>&gt; 110,000 =
shs.&nbsp; The=20
      market maker was caught flatfooted.&nbsp; We quickly sold<BR>&gt; =
out of=20
      our position because we were over the 5% =
threshold.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Those=20
      trading Island or other ECN's may have been filled around<BR>&gt;=20
      32.40-32.50.&nbsp; We watch Time and Sales on all our fills and =
the=20
      only<BR>&gt; prints were coming from ECN's.&nbsp; With CANSLIM =
being one=20
      of the most<BR>&gt; popular strategies for individual investors, =
execution=20
      is becoming<BR>more<BR>&gt; and more difficult.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ed =

      Gjertsen II<BR>&gt; <A=20
      =
href=3D"mailto:ed@macktracks.com">ed@macktracks.com</A><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<B=
R>&gt;=20
      -<BR>&gt; -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "<A=20
      =
href=3D"mailto:majordomo@xmission.com">majordomo@xmission.com</A>"<BR>&gt=
;=20
      -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or<BR>&gt; =
- -"unsubscribe=20
      canslim".&nbsp; Do not use quotes in your =
email.<BR><BR><BR>-<BR>-To=20
      subscribe/unsubscribe, email "<A=20
      =
href=3D"mailto:majordomo@xmission.com">majordomo@xmission.com</A>"<BR>-In=
=20
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