Go to Jeff Salisbury LWGate Home Page.From: "Katherine Malm" <kmalm@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] FLOAT
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 17:10:58 -0600
Next Article (by Author): Re: [CANSLIM] screens of the day "Norman Boyd"
Previous Article (by Author): Re: [CANSLIM] "M" "Don Canfield"
Articles sorted by: [Date]
[Author]
[Subject]
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C28A6E.781DA6C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Luis, The percentages are difficult to calculate meaningfully unless somebody = is double checking numbers before reporting. It's entirely possible that when Yahoo/MarketGuide does their = calculations that they are counting all institutions as a percentage of = float whether or not they are insider (5%+ beneficial owners). For = example, look at the MSN ownership summary and you will see that Bain = and Alliance Capital are beneficial owners, but they are *also* = institutions (about 6.7 million shares). That means that if you look at = total percent of the float that is owned by institutions, that = mathematically, it would turn out to be a number greater than 100%. Of = course, that makes no logical sense, because their shares aren't = available to easily change hands in the market unless they first report = to the SEC. (Insider/5% Beneficial owners + Float =3D Outstanding) http://moneycentral.msn.com/investor/invsub/ownership/ownership.asp The other complication to calculating percent of the float or of the = outstanding shares is that institutions only report once a quarter. If = you look at the Yahoo/Marketguide report and the MSN report, you can see = that some of the reports are outdated and that the same reporting is not = showing on both sites. That means that if any shares have changed hands, = the total institutional shares as a percent of the 37.5m shares = outstanding will not add up as they should. http://moneycentral.msn.com/investor/invsub/ownership/ownership.asp http://biz.yahoo.com/hd/s/srcl.html The other possible complication to the calculations is the adjustments = to shares based on secondary offerings and/or splits. If = Yahoo/Marketguide and/or MSN are careless about updates, then you'll see = discrepancies when the shares owned by institutions as a percentage of = outstanding shares are calculated. Now, to make things *really* complicated, when DGO reports their = numbers, they show Management/Insiders as a % of the *outstanding* = shares, then show Mutual Funds and Banks as a % of the *Float*!! It's = crazy and you have to be careful when looking at one data source vs. = another. All in all, I don't see the actual percentage as all that important = unless it is extraordinarily high. I'm far more interested in the = *pattern* of ownership. That is, are more institutions continuing to buy = or to sell their positions? I'm also interested in what the better = quality institutions are doing. If *they* are buying, then that carries = more weight. That said, of all the things that I use to evaluate a = company for purchase, this is quite honestly one of the *least* = important. I think that technical condition and basic fundamentals such = as revenue/earnings growth are far more telling. Institutions leave = their tracks in the price/volume charts, so looking at the detailed = institutional ownership is really a double check more than anything. Katherine ----- Original Message -----=20 From: luis claramunt=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2002 9:27 AM Subject: [CANSLIM] FLOAT Hi, =20 While doing my weekly research I came across in Yahoo Finance with the = profile for SRCL, under Ownership Institutional is appeared 123% of = float. =20 A definition of float is the shares left over for possible purchase = after substracting stock that is closely held (How to make money in = stocks, page 33); my doubt is: who come do they come with this 123%? =20 I need some light on it. =20 Best Regards to all, =20 Luis Claramunt San Jose, Costa Rica mail to: luclaxu@racsa.co.cr - ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C28A6E.781DA6C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML xmlns:o =3D "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; = charset=3Diso-8859-1"> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2719.2200" name=3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <DIV>Hi Luis,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV>The percentages are difficult to calculate meaningfully unless = somebody is=20 double checking numbers before reporting.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It's entirely possible that when Yahoo/MarketGuide does their = calculations=20 that they are counting all institutions as a percentage of float whether = or not=20 they are insider (5%+ beneficial owners). For example, look at the MSN = ownership=20 summary and you will see that Bain and Alliance Capital are beneficial = owners,=20 but they are *also* institutions (about 6.7 million shares). That means = that if=20 you look at total percent of the float that is owned by institutions, = that=20 mathematically, it would turn out to be a number greater than 100%. Of = course,=20 that makes no logical sense, because their shares aren't available to = easily=20 change hands in the market unless they first report to the SEC. = (Insider/5%=20 Beneficial owners + Float =3D Outstanding)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><A=20 href=3D"http://moneycentral.msn.com/investor/invsub/ownership/ownership.a= sp">http://moneycentral.msn.com/investor/invsub/ownership/ownership.asp</= A></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The other complication to calculating percent of the float or of = the=20 outstanding shares is that institutions only report once a quarter. If = you look=20 at the Yahoo/Marketguide report and the MSN report, you can see that = some of the=20 reports are outdated and that the same reporting is not showing on both = sites.=20 That means that if any shares have changed hands, the total = institutional shares=20 as a percent of the 37.5m shares outstanding will not add up as they=20 should.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><A=20 href=3D"http://moneycentral.msn.com/investor/invsub/ownership/ownership.a= sp">http://moneycentral.msn.com/investor/invsub/ownership/ownership.asp</= A></DIV> <DIV><A=20 href=3D"http://biz.yahoo.com/hd/s/srcl.html">http://biz.yahoo.com/hd/s/sr= cl.html</A></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The other possible complication to the calculations is the = adjustments to=20 shares based on secondary offerings and/or splits. If Yahoo/Marketguide = and/or=20 MSN are careless about updates, then you'll see discrepancies when the = shares=20 owned by institutions as a percentage of outstanding shares are=20 calculated.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now, to make things *really* complicated, when DGO reports their = numbers,=20 they show Management/Insiders as a % of the *outstanding* shares, then = show=20 Mutual Funds and Banks as a % of the *Float*!! It's crazy and you have = to be=20 careful when looking at one data source vs. another.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All in all, I don't see the actual percentage as all that important = unless=20 it is extraordinarily high. I'm far more interested in the *pattern* of=20 ownership. That is, are more institutions continuing to buy or to sell = their=20 positions? I'm also interested in what the better quality institutions = are=20 doing. If *they* are buying, then that carries more weight. That said, = of all=20 the things that I use to evaluate a company for purchase, this is quite = honestly=20 one of the *least* important. I think that technical condition and basic = fundamentals such as revenue/earnings growth are far more telling. = Institutions=20 leave their tracks in the price/volume charts, so looking at the = detailed=20 institutional ownership is really a double check more than = anything.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Katherine</DIV> <DIV> </DIV></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20 style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; = BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV=20 style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = black"><B>From:</B>=20 <A title=3Dluclaxu@racsa.co.cr = href=3D"mailto:luclaxu@racsa.co.cr">luis=20 claramunt</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A = title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20 = href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>= </DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, November 05, = 2002 9:27=20 AM</DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [CANSLIM] FLOAT</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2>Hi,</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2> =20 <P class=3DMsoBodyText>While doing my weekly research I came across in = Yahoo=20 Finance with the profile for SRCL, under Ownership Institutional is = appeared=20 123% of float.</P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: justify"><SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: justify"><SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial">A definition of float is the shares left = over for=20 possible purchase after substracting stock that is closely held (How = to make=20 money in stocks, page 33); my doubt is: who come<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>do they come with this=20 123%?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: justify"><SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: justify"><SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I need some light on = it.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: justify"><SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: justify"><SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Best Regards to = all,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: justify"><SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P><SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-fareast-font-family: = 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: = EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">Luis=20 Claramunt</SPAN></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2><BR>San Jose, Costa = Rica<BR>mail to: <A=20 = href=3D"mailto:luclaxu@racsa.co.cr">luclaxu@racsa.co.cr</A></FONT></DIV><= /BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML> - ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C28A6E.781DA6C0-- - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email.
Next Article (by Author): Re: [CANSLIM] screens of the day "Norman Boyd"
Previous Article (by Author): Re: [CANSLIM] "M" "Don Canfield"
Articles sorted by: [Date]
[Author]
[Subject]