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Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] *** OFF TOPIC *** Anti CANSLIM ** Hit Delete
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 19:26:07 -0400
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C35087.19AED0C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Gene....an interesting post. At the risk of sliding even further into a = non-Canslim discussion, is there a VV user out there that can explain or = define the VV "relative safety" and "relative timing" features. How does = "relative timing" differ from RS? Thanks. Jon - ---------------------------------------------------- This mailbox protected from junk email by Matador from MailFrontier, Inc. http://info.mailfrontier.com ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Gene Ricci=20 To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 7:11 PM Subject: [CANSLIM] *** OFF TOPIC *** Anti CANSLIM ** Hit Delete A couple of days ago someone asked about VectorVest and CANSLIM. = Here's a person that thinks using VV is better than looking for CS = candidates. I removed his name. The following was posted on one of the = VectorVest Yahoo Groups this morning (by long time VV user).=20 Gene Anti CANSLIM =20 Much has been written about William O'Neil's stock selection and = market timing. Glowing reports of great results and performances = overshadow the errors in the system that prevent people from being = successful investors. Here's my opinion of the Hollywood Huckster's = system. =20 1) William O'Neil has only one system of strategy - buying stocks = on breakouts. Some people claim that this is the holy grail, but others = have found that they're buying at the top of the stock, not the bottom = of a great beginning. My personal experience has been that after I buy = at a pivot point, the stock then plunges at least 20% so I have to dump = the stock and wait until my account is sufficient to buy with. I have = destroyed my account totally at least three times since beginning with = the system. I used CANSLIM from 1988 to 1998, and had only one good = year, 1991, when I matched the S&P. All other years I lost money. On = the contrary, VectorVest has an unlimited number of strategies that can = be implemented. =20 2) William O'Neil has no idea as to when to sell a stock. In the = book, How to Make Money in Stocks, he outlines 30 potential sell points. = What I gather is that HE DOESN'T KNOW!! =20 =20 3) William O'Neil suggest that one should buy stocks only priced = above 12 or 15 dollars a share. Sorry, fella, but penny stock = strategies are sound, as Zach's Zoomers has been a great success. =20 4) William O'Neil says you need to buy low cap stocks. What this = means is that you buy stocks with 1 million float or so. This is more = dangerous than ever, as the slightest activity of selling can sent the = stock crashing. =20 5) In Investor's Business Daily, you can find nothing that = matches VectorVest's Relative Safety feature. Basically, IBD's highly = touted stocks are a piece of trash that made it to the top rankings by = earnings increase alone. =20 6) The Relative Strength and Earnings Per Share rankings are of = no use when trying to find quality stocks. VectorVest's Relative Timing = is far superior as it gives an accurate picture of what the stock is = doing in recent performance. IBD's ranking implies there are a certain = number of stocks at 99, the same at 98 etc. Since the ranking is = relative, you can't tell if the market is going under accumulation or = distribution. =20 7) Chart formation analysis is the bastion of IBD's system. = However, you take a look at some of the formations and you will swear = there is no rhyme or reason to buying the kind of stocks he suggests. = Chart formations are not automatic and do not guarantee results. The = cup and handle formation is not a trip to financial freedom as WON = suggests. 8) William O'Neil has no safe strategy with his system. = Basically, if you want to buy quality large cap stocks, you're out of = luck. WON ran a mutual fund in the 1960's, and he was first one year = then last the next. WON likes volatile stocks that move up and down = fast for a wild ride. Sustainable results? Not likely. Also whiz kid = David Ryan ran a mutual fund in the 1999's called the New USA Growth = Fund. His performance was mediocre and the fund was sold after 5 years. = David probably gave up as he wasn't getting spectacular results as well = as he got in his contest results in the 1980's. =20 9) The volume of chart formation reading makes CANSLIM a burden = of beast instead of a easy reference that VV gives. With VV, at the = touch of a button, I get 10 potential purchases. With CANSLIM I have to = wade through tons of material to reach my 7 stocks. It's so much work = you can't give any time to your life. =20 10) William O'Neil suggest to buy one or two stocks if you have $5K = to $10K and progress up to a 5 stock portfolio. Most beginning = investors have a limited amount of money and the burden of picking big = winners is very difficult. If they strike out on one or two stocks, how = are they to regain confidence? On the contrary, VectorVest suggests = buying 10 stocks at a time to diversify. CANSLIM does not diversify, in = fact id concentrates into a few stocks. I would not stray from = legendary stock guru John Templeton's way of diversification. =20 11) Try to find a short strategy like VectorVest has and you'll have = a hard time finding one in IBD. Because William O'Neil has been snuffed = out in more bear markets than he can remember. He tried to do it with = chart formations and it's not the way to go with shorts. VectorVest is = right on target with short strategies, and it's at the touch of a = button. =20 12) CANSLIM - CAN'T SWIM XXXXX - ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C35087.19AED0C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML xmlns:o =3D "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; = charset=3Diso-8859-1"> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1170" name=3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana color=3D#0000ff>Gene....an interesting post. = At the risk=20 of sliding even further into a non-Canslim discussion, is = there a VV=20 user out there that can explain or define the VV "relative safety" and = "relative=20 timing" features. How does "relative timing" differ from RS?=20 Thanks.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana color=3D#0000ff></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana color=3D#0000ff>Jon</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>----------------------------------------------------<BR>This = mailbox=20 protected from junk email by Matador<BR>from MailFrontier, Inc. <A=20 href=3D"http://info.mailfrontier.com">http://info.mailfrontier.com</A><BR= ></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20 style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; = BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV=20 style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = black"><B>From:</B>=20 <A title=3Dgenr@swbell.net href=3D"mailto:genr@swbell.net">Gene = Ricci</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A = title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20 = href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>= </DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, July 22, 2003 = 7:11=20 PM</DIV> <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [CANSLIM] *** OFF = TOPIC *** Anti=20 CANSLIM ** Hit Delete</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">A couple of days ago someone asked = about=20 VectorVest and CANSLIM. Here's a person that thinks using VV is better = than=20 looking for CS candidates. I removed his name. The following was = posted=20 on one of the VectorVest Yahoo Groups this morning (by long time = VV=20 user).</FONT><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans = MS">=20 </FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT=20 face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans = MS">Gene</FONT></DIV> <DIV> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"></FONT> </P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">Anti CANSLIM</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">Much has been written about William = O=92Neil=92s stock=20 selection and market timing.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> =20 </SPAN>Glowing reports of great results and performances overshadow = the errors=20 in the system that prevent people from being successful = investors.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Here=92s my opinion of the = Hollywood=20 Huckster=92s system.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">1)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> =20 </SPAN>William O=92Neil has only one system of strategy =96 buying = stocks on=20 breakouts.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Some people = claim that=20 this is the holy grail, but others have found that they=92re buying at = the top=20 of the stock, not the bottom of a great beginning.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>My personal experience has = been that=20 after I buy at a pivot point, the stock then plunges at least 20% so I = have to=20 dump the stock and wait until my account is sufficient to buy = with.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I have destroyed my account = totally at=20 least three times since beginning with the system.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I used CANSLIM from 1988 to = 1998, and=20 had only one good year, 1991, when I matched the S&P.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>All other years I lost = money.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>On the contrary, VectorVest = has an=20 unlimited number of strategies that can be implemented.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">2)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> =20 </SPAN>William O=92Neil has no idea as to when to sell a stock.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>In the book, How to Make = Money in=20 Stocks, he outlines 30 potential sell points.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>What I gather is that HE = DOESN=92T=20 KNOW!!<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">3)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> =20 </SPAN>William O=92Neil suggest that one should buy stocks only priced = above 12=20 or 15 dollars a share.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> = </SPAN>Sorry,=20 fella, but penny stock strategies are sound, as Zach=92s Zoomers has = been a=20 great success.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">4)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> =20 </SPAN>William O=92Neil says you need to buy low cap stocks.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>What this means is that you = buy stocks=20 with 1 million float or so.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> = </SPAN>This=20 is more dangerous than ever, as the slightest activity of selling can = sent the=20 stock crashing.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">5)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> = </SPAN>In=20 Investor=92s Business Daily, you can find nothing that matches = VectorVest=92s=20 Relative Safety feature.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> =20 </SPAN>Basically, IBD=92s highly touted stocks are a piece of trash = that made it=20 to the top rankings by earnings increase alone.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">6)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> = </SPAN>The=20 Relative Strength and Earnings Per Share rankings are of no use when = trying to=20 find quality stocks.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> = </SPAN>VectorVest=92s=20 Relative Timing is far superior as it gives an accurate picture of = what the=20 stock is doing in recent performance.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: = yes"> =20 </SPAN>IBD=92s ranking implies there are a certain number of stocks at = 99, the=20 same at 98 etc.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Since = the ranking=20 is relative, you can=92t tell if the market is going under = accumulation or=20 distribution.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">7)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> =20 </SPAN>Chart formation analysis is the bastion of IBD=92s system.<SPAN = style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>However, you take a look at = some of=20 the formations and you will swear there is no rhyme or reason to = buying the=20 kind of stocks he suggests.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> = </SPAN>Chart=20 formations are not automatic and do not guarantee results.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The cup and handle formation = is not a=20 trip to financial freedom as WON suggests.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"></FONT> </P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">8)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> =20 </SPAN>William O=92Neil has no safe strategy with his system.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Basically, if you want to = buy quality=20 large cap stocks, you=92re out of luck.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: = yes"> =20 </SPAN>WON ran a mutual fund in the 1960=92s, and he was first one = year then=20 last the next. <SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>WON = likes volatile=20 stocks that move up and down fast for a wild ride.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Sustainable results?<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Not likely.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Also whiz kid David Ryan ran = a mutual=20 fund in the 1999=92s called the New USA Growth Fund.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>His performance was mediocre = and the=20 fund was sold after 5 years.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> =20 </SPAN>David probably gave up as he wasn=92t getting spectacular = results as well=20 as he got in his contest results in the 1980=92s.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">9)<SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> = </SPAN>The=20 volume of chart formation reading makes CANSLIM a burden of beast = instead of a=20 easy reference that VV gives.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> =20 </SPAN>With VV, at the touch of a button, I get 10 potential = purchases.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>With CANSLIM I have to wade = through=20 tons of material to reach my 7 stocks.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: = yes"> =20 </SPAN>It=92s so much work you can=92t give any time to your = life.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">10)<SPAN style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New = Roman'"> =20 </SPAN><SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>William O=92Neil = suggest to=20 buy one or two stocks if you have $5K to $10K and progress up to a 5 = stock=20 portfolio.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Most = beginning=20 investors have a limited amount of money and the burden of picking big = winners=20 is very difficult.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>If = they strike=20 out on one or two stocks, how are they to regain confidence?<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>On the contrary, VectorVest = suggests=20 buying 10 stocks at a time to diversify.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: = yes"> =20 </SPAN>CANSLIM does not diversify, in fact id concentrates into a few=20 stocks.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I would not = stray from=20 legendary stock guru John Templeton=92s way of = diversification.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">11)<SPAN style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New = Roman'"> =20 </SPAN><SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Try to find a = short=20 strategy like VectorVest has and you=92ll have a hard time finding one = in=20 IBD.<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Because William = O=92Neil has=20 been snuffed out in more bear markets than he can remember.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>He tried to do it with chart = formations and it=92s not the way to go with shorts.<SPAN=20 style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>VectorVest is right on = target with=20 short strategies, and it=92s at the touch of a button.</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman">12)<SPAN style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New = Roman'"> =20 </SPAN>CANSLIM =96 CAN=92T SWIM</FONT></P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 = level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list .5in"><FONT=20 face=3D"Times New Roman"></FONT> </P> <P class=3DMsoNormal=20 style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in = 0pt">XXXXX</P></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML> - ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C35087.19AED0C0-- - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". 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