Go to Jeff Salisbury LWGate Home Page.From: "Gene Ricci" <genr@swbell.net>
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Another mystery plunge
Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2003 15:56:18 -0500
Next Article (by Date): RE: [CANSLIM] Another mystery plunge "Katherine Malm"
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Hi Katherine,
Thanks for taking the time to help me understand.
Have one last question (for today) concerning your fundie scores. Can a =
subscriber ask for a list of stocks, in your data base, that have =
scores of >/=3D 8 out of 11 or some other combination? And, if so, can =
the list be exported to a spreadsheet?
Gene
=20
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Katherine Malm=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2003 3:30 PM
Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] Another mystery plunge
Hi Gene,
There is never intention to stray from CANSLIM principles. As you =
know, I am very much a purist in my interpretation of CANSLIM, though I =
do recognize and speak freely on the limitations and pitfalls of IBD =
industry and stock rankings. In all of our help files we also caution =
about the limitations of each particular measurement, whether it is the =
CE score or an industry ranking/score. CE scores are not intended to =
emulate IBD's proprietary rankings such as SMR/EPS/Timeliness/AD and =
other Stock Checkup rankings that they use on the Investors.com site so =
you there is not a comparison of one vs. another. Instead, we provide a =
way for people to grasp the general technical health of the stock (CET) =
and the how closely the stock's fundamentals match the CANSLIM yardstick =
(CEF). Again, neither of these are used to identify stocks setting up, =
just the technical price action of the stock. The help files throughout =
the site itself explain industry ranks, ranks within industry, etc, so I =
will not go into them here, as that would not be appropriate for general =
discussion on a public CANSLIM list. The help file on the charts, which =
we also make available to CANSLIM list members, give the definitions of =
key items such as comparative RS (RS Line), RS (RS Rank), U/D ratio etc. =
See it by clicking on the help file on a chart:
http://www.breakoutwatch.com/charts/kmchart.php
These are the same as the indicators you see on IBD/DGO charts, as =
they are standardized technical measurements, not IBD proprietary =
measurements. The only difference is that we do not include Canadian =
stocks in our database as does IBD/DGO, so our RSRanks are slightly =
different as a result. The same is true of HGSI/QP2, which also does not =
include Canadian stocks.=20
As you know, over the years, the DGO/IBD staff and lawyers lurk on our =
list. They have made a habit of sending legal letters or making phone =
calls from their lawyers to individuals on this list when they feel =
their proprietary data is being encroached. That effectively prevents =
any of us from using one of their IBD or DGO charts for annotations =
during a discussion, and for the most part from even *mentioning* the =
values of proprietary indicators such as SMR, EPS, AD, etc. In my =
discussion with the head of the Wm O'Neil Corporation, I asked why they =
did not allow us to use these for discussions, as it was difficult to =
have meaningful CANSLIM discussions by the book when we were not allowed =
to quote these values. I asked in vein if they would be willing to =
provide our list with good faith guidelines, as using their data and =
their products in discussion actually promoted the use of their =
products. They did not respond.
As a result, Mike & I wanted to provide an alternative for list =
members that would allow them, without fear of retribution, be able to =
discuss the fundamental and/or technical attributes of a stock, and that =
was the reason we continue to make both the CANSLIM evaluator and our =
charts available to folks here on the list.=20
Katherine
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com =
[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Gene Ricci
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2003 12:39 PM
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Another mystery plunge
Katherine, many thanks for the links to the explanation of the BOW =
terminology. Using terms different than the IBD language is hard on =
those that don't subscribe. In fact, getting agreement on the meaning =
of IBD terminology is a chore in itself. I hope that this user group =
doesn't stray far from the WON concepts/terminology that took me quite =
some to learn and gain a minimal working knowledge of.....
If my interpretation of the BOW terminology is correct, CET does not =
stand for TA but rather a minimum set of objective technical criteria =
that is part of your service. I couldn't find a matrix showing how your =
definitions match IBD's definitions.
Can I assume that your numbers for the following match IBDs?
1. RS
2. Industry Rank prior to the secondary sort
3. Up/Down Ratio
BTW, the new design of your site looks to be user friendly!
regards,
Gene
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Katherine Malm=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2003 11:36 AM
Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] Another mystery plunge
Gene,
Please see the help file on our CE scores at:
http://www.breakoutwatch.com/canslim/CE_methodology.htm
This file is available by clicking the "Help" button on the =
Canslim Evaluator, which we make available to the CANSLIM list members =
who wish to use it
http://www.breakoutwatch.com/canslim/
On CET specifically (from the help file, emphasis added),
"In How to Make Money in Stocks, O'Neil describes the preferred =
technical condition of a stock at the time of a breakout, but does not =
provide a more general description of a "technically healthy" stock. As =
the goal of the CET is to provide some means of determining the =
technical health of a stock whether or not it is setting up for a =
breakout, we assign a score based on objective measurements of the =
stock's price/volume action over the intermediate to long term. Scores =
do not take into account very near term action of the stock such as a =
recent breakdown, reversal, a broken short-term trend etc. "
Katherine
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com =
[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Gene Ricci
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2003 10:21 AM
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Another mystery plunge
Hong, can you translate CET terminology into IBD jargon?=20
Thanks,
Gene
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Hong Hsu=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2003 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Another mystery plunge
DMC,
For OSTE, the total TA score (CET) from breakoutwatch.com =
is 6.8=20
out of 7. With that score I will tend to believe it has solid =
TA. Does=20
it? Maybe Katherine could share her insight.
-Hong
-
-To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com"
-In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or
-"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email.
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<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
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</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Hi Katherine,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Thanks for taking the time to help me=20
understand.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Have one last question (for today) =
concerning=20
your fundie scores. Can a subscriber ask for a list of stocks, in your =
data=20
base, that have scores of >/=3D 8 out of 11 or some other =
combination?=20
And, if so, can the list be exported to a spreadsheet?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Gene</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dkmalm@earthlink.net =
href=3D"mailto:kmalm@earthlink.net">Katherine=20
Malm</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, July 25, 2003 =
3:30 PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [CANSLIM] Another =
mystery=20
plunge</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003>Hi Gene,</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003>There is never intention to =
stray from=20
CANSLIM principles. As you know, I am very much a purist in my =
interpretation=20
of CANSLIM, though I do recognize and speak freely on the limitations =
and=20
pitfalls of IBD industry and stock rankings. In all of our help =
files we=20
also caution about the limitations of each particular =
measurement,=20
whether it is the CE score or an industry ranking/score. CE =
scores=20
are not intended to emulate IBD's proprietary rankings such as=20
SMR/EPS/Timeliness/AD and other Stock Checkup rankings that they use =
on the=20
Investors.com site so you there is not a comparison of one vs. =
another.=20
Instead, we provide a way for people to grasp the general technical =
health of=20
the stock (CET) and the how closely the stock's fundamentals match the =
CANSLIM=20
yardstick (CEF). Again, neither of these are used =
to identify=20
stocks setting up, just the technical price action of the =
stock. The=20
help files throughout the site itself explain industry ranks, ranks =
within=20
industry, etc, so I will not go into them here, as that would not be=20
appropriate for general discussion on a public CANSLIM list. The help =
file on=20
the charts, which we also make available to CANSLIM list members, give =
the=20
definitions of key items such as comparative RS (RS Line), RS (RS =
Rank), U/D=20
ratio etc. See it by clicking on the help file on a =
chart:</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003><A=20
=
href=3D"http://www.breakoutwatch.com/charts/kmchart.php">http://www.break=
outwatch.com/charts/kmchart.php</A></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003>These are the same as the =
indicators you=20
see on IBD/DGO charts, as they are standardized technical =
measurements, not=20
IBD proprietary measurements. The only difference is that we do not =
include=20
Canadian stocks in our database as does IBD/DGO, so our RSRanks are =
slightly=20
different as a result. The same is true of HGSI/QP2, which also does =
not=20
include Canadian stocks. </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003>As you know, over the years, the =
DGO/IBD=20
staff and lawyers lurk on our list. They have made a habit of sending =
legal=20
letters or making phone calls from their lawyers to individuals on =
this list=20
when they feel their proprietary data is being encroached. That =
effectively=20
prevents any of us from using one of their IBD or DGO charts for =
annotations=20
during a discussion, and for the most part from even *mentioning* the =
values=20
of proprietary indicators such as SMR, EPS, AD, etc. In my discussion =
with the=20
head of the Wm O'Neil Corporation, I asked why they did not allow us =
to use=20
these for discussions, as it was difficult to have meaningful CANSLIM=20
discussions by the book when we were not allowed to quote these =
values. I=20
asked in vein if they would be willing to provide our list with good =
faith=20
guidelines, as using their data and their products in discussion =
actually=20
promoted the use of their products. They did not respond.</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003>As a result, Mike & I wanted =
to=20
provide an alternative for list members that would allow them, without =
fear of=20
retribution, be able to discuss the fundamental and/or technical =
attributes of=20
a stock, and that was the reason we continue to make both the CANSLIM=20
evaluator and our charts available to folks here on the list. =
</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003>Katherine</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D600335519-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>=20
owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Gene=20
Ricci<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, July 25, 2003 12:39 PM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
canslim@lists.xmission.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] Another =
mystery=20
plunge<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Katherine, many thanks for the =
links to the=20
explanation of the BOW terminology. Using terms different than the =
IBD=20
language is hard on those that don't subscribe. In fact, =
getting=20
agreement on the meaning of IBD terminology is a chore in itself.=20
I hope that this user group doesn't stray far from =
the WON=20
concepts/terminology that took me quite some to learn and=20
gain a minimal working knowledge of.....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">If my interpretation of the BOW =
terminology=20
is correct, CET does not stand for TA but rather a minimum set of =
objective=20
technical criteria that is part of your service. I couldn't find a =
matrix=20
showing how your definitions match IBD's =
definitions.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Can I assume that your =
numbers for the=20
following match IBDs?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">1. RS</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">2. Industry Rank prior to the =
secondary=20
sort</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">3. Up/Down Ratio</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">BTW, the new design of your site =
looks to be=20
user friendly!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">regards,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Gene</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dkmalm@earthlink.net =
href=3D"mailto:kmalm@earthlink.net">Katherine=20
Malm</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, July 25, 2003 =
11:36=20
AM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [CANSLIM] =
Another=20
mystery plunge</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003>Gene,</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003>Please see the help file on =
our CE=20
scores at:</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003><A=20
=
href=3D"http://www.breakoutwatch.com/canslim/CE_methodology.htm">http://w=
ww.breakoutwatch.com/canslim/CE_methodology.htm</A></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003>This file is available by =
clicking the=20
"Help" button on the Canslim Evaluator, which we make available to =
the=20
CANSLIM list members who wish to use it</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003><A=20
=
href=3D"http://www.breakoutwatch.com/canslim/">http://www.breakoutwatch.c=
om/canslim/</A><A=20
href=3D"http://www.breakoutwatch.com/"></A></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003>On CET specifically (from =
the help=20
file, emphasis added),</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003>"In <I>How to Make Money in =
Stocks,=20
</I>O=92Neil describes the preferred technical condition of a =
stock at the=20
time of a breakout, but does not provide a more general =
description of a=20
=93technically healthy=94 stock. As the goal of the CET is to =
provide some=20
means of determining the technical health of a stock whether or =
not it is=20
setting up for a breakout, we assign a score based on objective=20
measurements of the stock=92s price/volume action over the =
intermediate to=20
long term. <EM><STRONG>Scores do not take into account very near =
term=20
action of the stock such as a recent breakdown, reversal, a broken =
short-term trend etc.</STRONG></EM> <EM>"</EM></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D818323116-25072003>Katherine</SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>=20
owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com]<B>On Behalf Of =
</B>Gene=20
Ricci<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, July 25, 2003 10:21 =
AM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
canslim@lists.xmission.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] =
Another=20
mystery plunge<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Hong, can you translate CET =
terminology=20
into IBD jargon? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Thanks,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Gene</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dhonghsu@bellatlantic.net=20
href=3D"mailto:honghsu@bellatlantic.net">Hong Hsu</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, July 25, =
2003 11:12=20
AM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] =
Another=20
mystery plunge</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV> =
DMC,<BR><BR> =20
For OSTE, the total TA score (CET) from =
breakoutwatch.com is 6.8=20
<BR>out of 7. With that score I will tend to believe it =
has=20
solid TA. Does <BR>it? Maybe Katherine could =
share=20
her insight.<BR><BR> =
- -Hong<BR><BR><BR><BR>-<BR>-To=20
subscribe/unsubscribe, email "<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:majordomo@xmission.com">majordomo@xmission.com</A>"<BR>-In=
=20
the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or<BR>-"unsubscribe=20
canslim". Do not use quotes in your=20
=
email.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOT=
E></BODY></HTML>
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Next Article (by Date): RE: [CANSLIM] Another mystery plunge "Katherine Malm"
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