Go to Jeff Salisbury LWGate Home Page.From: persfin-digest <owner-persfin-digest@shore.net>
Subject: persfin-digest V4 #79
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:18:09 -0400 (EDT)
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persfin-digest Tuesday, September 2 1997 Volume 04 : Number 079
IN THIS ISSUE:
ADVERTISEMENT: MCI FAX BROADCAST SERVICE [Oppenheimer Software <Connect-]
re: Quicken On-line Bill Paying - Ask Checkfree for Lower Price [Lloyd Co]
Re: Advice - No 401k for three months [Rich Carreiro <rlcarr@animato.pn.c]
Re: Questions about Roth IRA [Rich Carreiro <rlcarr@animato.pn.com>]
Re: Buying a Condo in Westchester [KATHLEEN OWENS <ACE.KOWENS@MEMO.ACEHA]
Re: Quicken Online Bill Paying - More than the Price ["Jeff Carpenter" <j]
Re: Value Of Home When Sold Without Agent? [Stephan <stephan@mail.org>]
re: Value of Home When Sold Without Agent [BOB FORD <BOB_FORD@compuserve]
Re: Quicken Online Bill Paying ["rip west" <rip@montrose.net>]
Free Loan? There Is No Such Thing... [borisv@ctron.com]
Re: where to put $10K? [FlaTimeOut@aol.com]
Re: Quicken's Online Bill Paying ["Mike O'Connor" <mikeo@dibaind.com>]
RE: Quicken On-line Bill Paying [garg@IMPACT.xerox.com (Sanjiv Garg)]
Re: Questions about Roth IRA [Jim McGrath <jimm@hi.com>]
Re: What to Do w/Car Accident [Avrum Lapin <avrum113@cyberg8t.com>]
Re: Advice - No 401k for three months [Avrum Lapin <avrum113@cyberg8t.com]
Re: Advice - No 401k for three months [Jim McGrath <jimm@hi.com>]
Helping my Mom Reinvest Her $$$ [writer@jlc.net (Dana B. Mackonis)]
WWW Problem [eric <eric_marcus@compuserve.com>]
Deciding between the Roth IRA v. Deductible IRA [jphoebus@shore.intercom.]
Should I roll my 401(k) into an IRA? ["Timothy A. Budd" <budd@owl.csusm.e]
Excellent Mutual Fund Program ["Larry Archer" <bullfrog@unix.infoserve.ne]
LOANs Info Wanted [MIRACLE58@aol.com]
Re: Quicken Online Bill Paying ["Mike Stefani" <mike-stefani@orgella.com>]
S&P 500 index fund? [Brian Michalak <brianm@pdt-cav.com>]
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Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:46:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: Oppenheimer Software <Connect-Sales@mcimail.com>
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:47:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: Lloyd Colston <kc5fm@bigfoot.com>
Subject: re: Quicken On-line Bill Paying - Ask Checkfree for Lower Price
If I were you, I would email Checkfree (who I have used all the
time) and ask them to lower the price. I think they will.
- --
Lloyd Colston Excellence is not an accident.
Pryor, OK USA social worker, writer, editor
Member: International Small Business Consortium
KC5FM Home page http://www.viagrafix.com/colston
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:47:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: Rich Carreiro <rlcarr@animato.pn.com>
Subject: Re: Advice - No 401k for three months
>What options, if any, do I have for the next three or so months to
>get around this problem?? If I can't make any deductible or
>sheltered contributions, should I make non-deductible contributions
>in a non-deductible or Roth IRA. Variable annuities??
Just a note -- Roth IRAs don't come into existence until 1/1/98, so
that's not an option for you for this year.
Rich Carreiro
rlcarr@animato.pn.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:49:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: Rich Carreiro <rlcarr@animato.pn.com>
Subject: Re: Questions about Roth IRA
[Disclaimer: this is my opinion, not advice. I am not a professional.]
>1. Is the Roth IRA available IN ADDITION TO a regular IRA,
NO.
> i.e., can I put $2000 into a regular IRA and then $2000
> into a Roth IRA? Or is the total contribution (to both
> types of IRA) limited to $2000 per year?
The aggregate IRA contribution (between "regular" IRAs, the education
account, and the Roth IRA) is $2000. There are also income
eligibility limits for contributing to a Roth IRA.
>2. Next year, can I "convert" my existing regular IRAs into
> Roth IRAs without being subject to the early-withdrawal
> penalty?
Yes.
> How? Will I have to sell all the securities and then buy them back again?
Almost definitely not. Most likely will be that the IRS will create a new
form for the purpose. Have to wait until rules are issued before a definitive
statement can be made, however.
>3. My regular IRAs were funded entirely using after-tax money.
> Will the act of converting them into Roth IRAs require me
> to pay any tax? If so, is the entire amount taxable, or
Absolutely! That's the point of the Roth IRA (from the govt's side)
- -- to induce people to pay more current tax (to help bring the budget
into balance).
> just the amount in excess of my (after-tax) contributions?
Almost definitely just the amount in excess of non-ded contributions.
Again, wait until rules are issued for a definitive answer.
Rich Carreiro
rlcarr@animato.pn.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:50:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: KATHLEEN OWENS <ACE.KOWENS@MEMO.ACEHARDWARE.COM>
Subject: Re: Buying a Condo in Westchester
(Satish is thinking about buying a condo in Westchester County, NY)
Satish,
I used to own a condo (bought it when I was 26) and here are some
tips from me:
1. Make sure you have a lawyer. Have him check out the
association and see if there are any judgements or if the
association is in the red. You don't want a hefty "Special
Assessment" when you move in to pay for their unbugeted expenses.
2. Talk to people who live there. See how they like the
community. How old is the building? Do they have a lot of
special assessments such as Roof repair, etc.
3. Live on the top floor!! Sure, your taxes may be higher, but
you will never hear footsteps from above at 3:00 AM.
4. Make sure you purchase a garage space if available. This is a
must for resale.
5. Check with your realtor (if you are going thru one) what is
the average time that most units in your condo have been on the
market. This is good knowledge to have for resale if you are
planning on only being there a couple of years.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:54:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Jeff Carpenter" <jeffcarp@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Quicken Online Bill Paying - More than the Price
>
> I have been using Quicken's online bill paying for about 9 months now
> and love it. For $5.95 they pay up to 20 bills/month. However, I just
> got a letter from them yesterday. They have merged with Checkfree
> (former competition) and instantly raised the price 67%, to $10/month
> for 20 bills. This makes it much more costly than stamps, which
> seriously detracts from its benefits I believe.
>
> Anyone else dealing with this? What are you planning to do?
Rick, there are a couple things to consider here. The price isn't merely a
67% rate increase. Most of the services that were ala carte before are now
included for free. This includes things like stop payment, copies of
checks, statements, etc. Granted, in 3.5 years I've never used these
services, but they ARE part of the monthly fee now.
Second, if you go OVER 20 bills per month is when it really starts paying
off. I forget the what the graduated scale is, but I believe you get the
next 10 payment for $2.95?
Thirdly, you are not considering other things besides the costs of
stamps in your comparison, mainly TIME. I can not put a value on the
amount of time Checkfree has saved me over the last 3.5 years. Especially
when you are using it through Quicken. I don't care if it costs DOUBLE the
price to mail a payment, I am going to continue to use it. Also, don't
forget about the cost of checks!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:55:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Stephan <stephan@mail.org>
Subject: Re: Value Of Home When Sold Without Agent?
Ken Stone asked
> If a home is sold without an agent then how should the value of the house
> be assessed in consideration of the price not including an agent's fee of 6%?
If I understand the question then: the selling price of the home should
reflect market value of comparable homes regardless of agents fees; these
fees are not part of the selling price they are merely fees for services
that the buyers and sellers agree to pay.
Agents fees (Real estate, attorney, inspector, etc) have
no relationship to the value of the home. There is no intrinsic
difference in value between like houses, one sold with and one without the
benefit of agents.
>From a tax standpoint the taxes and basis are taken from the bottom line
>on the closing statement (plus costs of any mortgage)so the net is
higher without the cost of an agent.
Have a great Labor Day,
Stephan
- --
at http://www.tpw.com/mi/siscoe
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:57:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: BOB FORD <BOB_FORD@compuserve.com>
Subject: re: Value of Home When Sold Without Agent
KEN
Sender: owner-persfin-mod@shore.net
Precedence: bulk
I have been a real estate investor for 25 years. During that time I have
bought and sold many homes. Perhaps my experience can help you.
A home's value is not connected to how it is sold. What determines the
value of a home is what similar homes in the area are selling for. It
does not matter whether they are sold with or without an agent.
It has been my experience that the best way to sell a home with or without
an agent is to get a formal appraisal. This should cost you $300 to $500
depending on your area. An independent appraisal is a powerful sales
tool. It shows the buyer that the price you are selling the home for is
fair price.
If you do not plan to use an agent when you sell your home, get some legal
advice from a local real estate attorney. That advice will be very cheap
insurance. Selling a home is serious business. If you make a mistake, it
could be costly.
GOOD LUCK
BOB FORD
BOB_FORD@COMPUSERVE.COM
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:58:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: "rip west" <rip@montrose.net>
Subject: Re: Quicken Online Bill Paying
> I have been using Quicken's online bill paying for about 9 months now
> and love it. For $5.95 they pay up to 20 bills/month. However, I just
> got a letter from them yesterday. They have merged with Checkfree
> (former competition) and instantly raised the price 67%, to $10/month
> for 20 bills. This makes it much more costly than stamps, which
> seriously detracts from its benefits I believe.
I have been using CoreStates, which started out free. It is now 3.95 a
month, which is less than postage. I suspect that the banks are guilty of
comeon's just like auto dealers. I think the only defense is to shop for
the best deal, and let your bank know why you are changing. I no longer
worry about the personal touch with banking. The term "personal Banker" is
an oxymoron.
rip
(Editor's Comment - Look at ATM fees. In the beginning ATMs were close to
free. Now the banks are charging whatever they can get away with. -IK)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:59:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: borisv@ctron.com
Subject: Free Loan? There Is No Such Thing...
Hi,
If I have $20K worth of stocks at my broker, and I make an order to buy
XYZ stock for $5K with no cash in the account, I assume that they
expect me to deliver additional funds during next 3 days. If I sell
XYZ the same day (or the next one) with a small profit, does it
represent a free loan I got from my broker? (Yeah, right! :)
As I said, I have enough other equity to cover my order, but account
isn't marginable (at least for now).
Just curious...
- -Boris
Dover,NH
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:01:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: FlaTimeOut@aol.com
Subject: Re: where to put $10K?
> I have $10,000 from a new 10 yr 7.3% equity loan that I expect to need
> next year for school for my son. I have no car loans, no credit card
> debt (ok, the equity loan was for more than $10k), 10 yrs left on a 15
> yr 7.5% first, good income (tho' only one) and several rental
> properties (that are highly leveraged but about breaking even at the
> moment).
>
> The $10k is sitting in my savings account right now -- who has
> suggestions about where to put it, and why?
Since you'll need it soon (next year) and I assume you'll need the
entire $10,000 (no possibility of principal loss) I'd suggest a money-market
fund. Vanguard is my favorite - if you can find one that's waiving its fees
for a year you might do a few basis points better. Why a MM fund?
Checkwriting features - easier to move the money to your son
(or his school) than redeeming a Treasury.>>
Why do you have proceeds from an equity loan sitting in an interest-bearing
account at all? Even if you are getting around 5.6% from the best money
market, like Strong, then you are still losing 1.7% in interest payments.
Sure, the interest is deductible but in the 28% tax bracket, for example,
your tax saving is only about $48 a year; you end up paying $122 more in
interest expense net. Why not just re-pay into the equity loan account and
draw down next year when you need it (presuming you can). If this is a term
loan with points, then of course you can't. Strong Funds pay highest MM rate.
If you can bear some risk, try Alliance Global Dollar Gov't Fund or the
Salomon Hi-Yield Bond Fund, both global hi-yield dollar-denominated bond
funds paying in the 9% level and which have appreciated steadily over the
past 2 years. Call Sen. V.P. Dean Williams at JW Charles 1-800-226-2600 for
more information.
(Editor's Question - Aren't they called "junk bonds"? -IK)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:01:57 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Mike O'Connor" <mikeo@dibaind.com>
Subject: Re: Quicken's Online Bill Paying
I dropped Checkfree, and switched my checking account to Peoples Bank,
which gives me free checking as well as the ability to pay my bills
electronically for free. I have been using Peoples to pay my bills for
about 3 months now, and I have not had any problems.
The only requirement for free checking is that you have your paycheck
direct deposited into the account. There is no minimum balance required.
Hope this helps.
Mike O'Connor
Network Administrator / Consultant
DIBA Consulting
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:02:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: garg@IMPACT.xerox.com (Sanjiv Garg)
Subject: RE: Quicken On-line Bill Paying
I use my bank's on-line bill payment which does not
cost anything. I've been using it for a year and am
very happy with it. Many banks offer free on-line bill
payment. I believe Citibank and Wells Fargo here in calif.
$10/month seems a bit excessive to me.
Sanjiv Garg
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:03:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jim McGrath <jimm@hi.com>
Subject: Re: Questions about Roth IRA
> 1. Is the Roth IRA available IN ADDITION TO a regular IRA,
> i.e., can I put $2000 into a regular IRA and then $2000
> into a Roth IRA? Or is the total contribution (to both
> types of IRA) limited to $2000 per year?
You can contribute a total of $2000. I believe you can split it
however you wish.
>
> 2. Next year, can I "convert" my existing regular IRAs into
> Roth IRAs without being subject to the early-withdrawal
> penalty? How? Will I have to sell all the securities
> and then buy them back again?
>
The last I read, you can convert a regular IRA to a Roth IRA, but you
will have to pay taxes on any pre-tax money that is converted. I
believe there is no penalty applicable.
> 3. My regular IRAs were funded entirely using after-tax money.
> Will the act of converting them into Roth IRAs require me
> to pay any tax? If so, is the entire amount taxable, or
> just the amount in excess of my (after-tax) contributions?
Dont forget that your capital gains and reinvested distributions are
pre-tax. I haven't seen this particular question addressed, and
assume that many details are still being worked out in the regulations
that implement the new law. I would guess that the conversion will be
taxed in the manner that IRA withdrawals are taxed using using form
8606 to calculate the ammount of post-tax withdrawal.
Jim
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:04:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: Avrum Lapin <avrum113@cyberg8t.com>
Subject: Re: What to Do w/Car Accident
>
>I scraped the bumper of another person's rental car, and don't know
>whether to claim insurance or pay myself. I guess the damage to the
>rental car is fairly minimal, and there was no damage to my car. My
>insurance agent says that the rental company will likely charge
>extras such as administrative and a loss-of-use fees, which could run
>another couple hundred dollars on top of the repair cost. So I'm
>curious as to what point (dollar-level) does it make sense to pay the
>damages out of pocket, versus filing an insurance claim. Any ideas?
Your insurance agent should tell you how much an at fault claim would add
to your premium (for 3 years). If not call another agent and get a quote
with an at fault claim and compare it with what you are paying. Some
arithmetic will tell you when to pay and when to file a claim. (Let us know)
Read your policy about the timeliness of filing a claim (in your defense
you could say that you saw no damage but he is now claiming). It is my
understanding that there may be no way that your insurer can evade a
liability claim if you are current on your premiums (disclaimer - not a
lawyer) but he can refuse to renew based on too many claims or failing to
mitigate a loss by filing in a timely manner (bad news)
If you decide to pay, get an quote from a reliable body shop for the work
to be done (per your description of the damage). When the rental company
sends you a threatening lawyer's letter, offer to settle for what the body
shop estimated without admitting guilt. Make them sue you for the
difference. This may be the point at which you would turn to your insurer.
The last time we had an at fault accident, my body shop inflated the
estimate so that the adjuster from the insurance company could negotiate
the price down. Everone was happy except I know that my premium reflects
all this diddling around.
Be careful because the people in the rental car may be watching late night
TV and see an ad from an ambulance chaser and decide that he wants to cash
in (he might be able to extort $5K from your insurer to go away). On the
other hand your ambulance chaser might suggest that the other driver
manuveured suddenly(without signalling) in front your car and caused the
accident which resulted in you having soft tissue injuries.
And this is why knock for knock no fault has it's advantages
Avrum Lapin
Upland., CA
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:05:13 -0400 (EDT)
From: Avrum Lapin <avrum113@cyberg8t.com>
Subject: Re: Advice - No 401k for three months
What ever you do make sure that you get that money out you your checking
account before you p... it away. Even a passbook account is better.
I don't think that you can shelter the money. I am leary about an IRA
vehicle because of the penalties for early withdrawal. Annuities usually
have too much of a front end load.
My suggestions;
Pay off any debts
A relatively tax efficient low expense no load fund
You are partially at risk in the new job. Both you and your new employer
will be seeing if they bought a pig in a poke for the next few months. Look
for some liquidity
Avrum Lapin
Upland., CA
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:06:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jim McGrath <jimm@hi.com>
Subject: Re: Advice - No 401k for three months
> I am looking for some advice on what to do in my current
> situation. I am changing jobs at the end of the month and won't be
> eligible to contribute to my new employer's 401k until January 1998.
> In the meantime, I have no tax-deductible retirement plan or
> employer-sponsored plan to shelter income from (our income puts us
> over the IRA phase-out limits).
>
It's probably too late now, but you could have increased your 401(k)
contributions to reach the $9500 limit before you left your job.
> What options, if any, do I have for the next three or so months to
> get around this problem?? If I can't make any deductible or
> sheltered contributions, should I make non-deductible contributions
> in a non-deductible or Roth IRA. Variable annuities??
There is really nothing you can do to get around the problem. If you
have money to invest and are comfortable doing so, you should invest
it regardless of the tax situation. Roth IRAs do not go into effect
until 1998. If you have the money, you should make non-deductible
contributions to an IRA in addition to your 401(k) contributions.
After that, it's a real toss up whether investments should go into a
variable annuity or a taxable account. Annuities tend to have rather
high expenses and convert capital gains to ordinary income. When the
capital gains tax rate was at 28%, it took the typical annuity about
10 years to come out ahead of a similar investment in a taxable
account. I haven't seen numbers for the new tax rates, but it's
obvious that the break even point will be even longer. If you can
afford to tie up your money until age 59.5, and you have a long
investment horizon, you may be able to come out ahead with a variable
annuity.
Jim
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:08:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: writer@jlc.net (Dana B. Mackonis)
Subject: Helping my Mom Reinvest Her $$$
I just came back from my mom's house after trying to help her
organize her bank books, etc. after my dad's death. Dear old dad
did not trust that the banks would not "loose" their money, so I
came up with a total of 9 pass book savings accounts totalling a
little over $50k.
I would like to get my mom to see a financial planner, but in case
I am not able to talk her into this... does anyone have any "safe"
suggestions on how a retired person should invest their assets.
The home and car are totally paid for and she has 0 debt.
Thanks....
dana - still shaking my head in disbelief.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:08:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: eric <eric_marcus@compuserve.com>
Subject: WWW Problem
When I attempt to access the www via either Netscape or Internet Explorer,
I frequently crash the first try. The second time is usually OK.(I have a
Mac powerbook.) Any ideas?
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:10:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: jphoebus@shore.intercom.net (John K. Phoebus)
Subject: Deciding between the Roth IRA v. Deductible IRA
I have a question about whether I should make my first IRA contribution to
a Roth or Deductible IRA.
I am just starting work after finishing law school. At age 25, I'm
setting up an IRA for myself (no 401k at the small law firm I work for).
Because I will only have significant income for the last quarter of 1997, I
am under the AGI limits for a deductible IRA and can deduct the $2000
contribution I make this year. However, next year, I will earn more than
the AGI phase-out and will not be eligible for the deduction and thus will
be making Roth IRA contributions.
My question is whether to deduct the contribution I will make this
year at all? I know that I would have a tax savings this year, but would
that really offset the hassle of the paperwork involved in keeping track of
two IRAs? one for 1997 and one for the following years? (or don't I need
to set up separate IRAs for roth/deductible?)
Any advice?
John
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:10:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Timothy A. Budd" <budd@owl.csusm.edu>
Subject: Should I roll my 401(k) into an IRA?
I am fairly new to the investing arena. Essentially my only investment
experience (aside from a savings account) is a year contribution to my
firms 401(k) for the past year. I have about 3,000 in the 401(k), however,
I am not fully vested in the fund for the employer contribution.
I am considering rolling over a portion my 401(k) into a private IRA so I
can broaden my investment opportunities. Our 401(k) manager is MET LIFE,
our choice of funds is extremely limited and the performance of the funds
given have been quite poor (the aggressive growth actually lost money over
the past year). So I guess I am looking for comments, adivice and
guidance in rolling over a portion, perhaps 1500 into a private IRA at an
online brokerage firm. I would like a mix of mutual funds and individual
stocks. I am 28 with a fairly with a substantial tolerance for risk.
First, can I roll over a portion of the 401(k) and continue the 401(k)? Is
the money I roll over subject to tax? Do I lose the unvested employer
contribution if I roll over some of the fund? What pitfalls should I be
aware of? And (I know its a loaded question) what online brokerage would
be good for someone in my situation. Thanks!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:12:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Larry Archer" <bullfrog@unix.infoserve.net>
Subject: Excellent Mutual Fund Program
I found an excellent Mutual Fund tracking program: invtr16g(1).zip on the
web site at: Download.com under business then under finance.
Its simple to use and reasonably priced...
Regards,
Larry Archer
Maple Ridge, B.C.
bullfrog@unix.infoserve.net
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:13:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: MIRACLE58@aol.com
Subject: LOANs Info Wanted
I was wondering if you knew of a place where I could get a loan
guaranteed, I have excellent credit it's just maxed out becuase I became
disabled 2 years ago and can no longer handle all of my bills.I need a loan
to pay off all of my bills
i could handle paying only one high bill!
please respond to miracle58.aol.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:14:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Mike Stefani" <mike-stefani@orgella.com>
Subject: Re: Quicken Online Bill Paying
Rick-
I suggest you check with your local banks, and find one that offers free
electronic bill payment. In Mass., my bank offers this service free, and
I think even gives away Quicken free to customers who meet certain minimum
balances, and the like (or at least used to.)
Regards.
Mike Stefani
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:15:45 -0400 (EDT)
From: Brian Michalak <brianm@pdt-cav.com>
Subject: S&P 500 index fund?
Does anybody know of any S&P 500 stock index mutual funds besides those
run by Dreyfus and Vanguard? Ideally, I'd like one with a lower initial
minimum.
------------------------------
End of persfin-digest V4 #79
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